Jump to content
oneBoro Forum

The Summer/Autumn transfers thread 2020 aka TURN DOWN FOR WHAT(more)


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 14.8k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Hi guys! PAOK fan here from Greece. You are getting a really hard worker in Akpom. He is a top lad and a good professional. When he first came, he was considered a bench player. It was the 2018-19 sea

Morsy nearly done

Williams fee nearly agreed. 1.75million rising to 2.5 (So 1.75 then ūüėā).

Posted Images

1 hour ago, TheHolgate said:

Finding out ITK stuff from people is good but it doesn't half feel like transfers are massively dragged out. 

25 years ago we would all be oblivious.

25 years ago we used to ring 0898 12 11 81 from the phone box and get the free 20 seconds of Boro news before it cut off.

  • Like 2
  • Haha 4
Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, uncle_rico said:

25 years ago we used to ring 0898 12 11 81 from the phone box and get the free 20 seconds of Boro news before it cut off.

The problem is that 25 years ago the Internet was only 4 years old so there was only 73 web pages up and running and 72 of them were porn ūüė≥

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Uwe said:

The problem is that 25 years ago the Internet was only 4 years old so there was only 73 web pages up and running and 72 of them were porn ūüė≥

73rd was a pair of tits still loading though hoping no one walked in by the time the page loaded

  • Haha 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, uncle_rico said:

25 years ago we used to ring 0898 12 11 81 from the phone box and get the free 20 seconds of Boro news before it cut off.

True fans were still getting news from Ceefax/Teletext in 2003, wanting page 6 and turning Ceefax on at page 7.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Tobermory Whitby said:

True fans were still getting news from Ceefax/Teletext in 2003, wanting page 6 and turning Ceefax on at page 7.

I so miss teletext and Ceefax page 302, what was the teletext number? 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Changing Times said:

No, their positions aren't relatively speaking better than our positions.  Football is based around performance and for the most part their performances have been worse than ours.  The size of club is irrelevant to what is being discussed, and that is how they operate and why can't Boro operate the same way.  If Boro did the same things as Brentford then we'd be in the exact same position as Brentford.  Us being a bigger club wouldn't make us better at it than they are, we'd be doing the exact same things as they are doing.  Our aim is to be in the Premier League so that model, up until this point, would be unsuccessful.  Indeed, we have been in the Premier League over that time as well.  If you set a target of something and you don't achieve it then yes that's failure as harsh as it might sound and what's ok for someone else might not be ok for us..  As for when the last time that a club of Brentford's size did such and such, what about Bournemouth?  Finally, I said that the player sales have nothing to do with him sinking £60m into the club, in fact he's had to put that money in despite the sales.  If you don't understand what I'm saying then please don't criticise it.

size is not irrelevant, its key, your viewing both clubs as equal but this is just wrong IMO, by your logic wycombe and Norwich both avoiding relegation next season is equal as the size of the club is irrlevant, when clearly it isnt. one has the power to spend millions, has prem experience and a much larger fan base and revenue stream,the other is playing at the level for the first in years. the size of the club has to be factored in any discussion on their achievements. 

when i mentioned if we had the same relative success i didn't mean exactly the same, we both started from different positions. there starting position was league 1 they got promoted and went championship playoff final, our starting position is top end championship club, so on a relative scale we would have achieved promotion given the same success. 

 iv looked at what the owner said, i think your taking him to literally, he said i quote “Every club in the Championship would like to get to the Premier League at some point, so we are no different. But we are not going to put a timeframe on it". its just like every club in the premier league would like to win the league, but to suggest that not doing so constitutes failure is just daft. you have to take into account club size and number of different factors, and when these are taken inconsideration what brentford have achieved thus far is incredible. IM sure Gibson said at one point he'd like to win the prem, are we failures for not doing so? i would argue not, but by your logic we would be. 

i do understand understand what your saying,  i dont think you get what im saying, in understand that he has invested money, but you cant just throw 60 million at a club because FFP exists now, you have to balance your books, how have Brentford balanced their books? through player sales, they have made a net profit in transfers of over 60 million over the last few seasons. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, tmcc said:

size is not irrelevant, its key, your viewing both clubs as equal but this is just wrong IMO, by your logic wycombe and Norwich both avoiding relegation next season is equal as the size of the club is irrlevant, when clearly it isnt. one has the power to spend millions, has prem experience and a much larger fan base and revenue stream,the other is playing at the level for the first in years. the size of the club has to be factored in any discussion on their achievements. 

when i mentioned if we had the same relative success i didn't mean exactly the same, we both started from different positions. there starting position was league 1 they got promoted and went championship playoff final, our starting position is top end championship club, so on a relative scale we would have achieved promotion given the same success. 

 iv looked at what the owner said, i think your taking him to literally, he said i quote “Every club in the Championship would like to get to the Premier League at some point, so we are no different. But we are not going to put a timeframe on it". its just like every club in the premier league would like to win the league, but to suggest that not doing so constitutes failure is just daft. you have to take into account club size and number of different factors, and when these are taken inconsideration what brentford have achieved thus far is incredible. IM sure Gibson said at one point he'd like to win the prem, are we failures for not doing so? i would argue not, but by your logic we would be. 

i do understand understand what your saying,  i dont think you get what im saying, in understand that he has invested money, but you cant just throw 60 million at a club because FFP exists now, you have to balance your books, how have Brentford balanced their books? through player sales, they have made a net profit in transfers of over 60 million over the last few seasons. 

 

If we had the same approach as Brentford we would be no better off than Brentford, which would be failure for us because we want to be in the Premier League.  I'm not bothered about what they want, I'm bothered about what we want.  I'm saying that they have failed to achieve the things that we are trying to achieve, not that they have been failures in themselves, so why would we want to emulate them?

You seem to have convinced yourself that if we did the same thing as them that we would somehow be better off than them and that doesn't make any sense.  What makes you think that if we operated in the same way that we would somehow be better off with it?  Being a bigger club is irrelevant if you are operating in the same way and frankly we aren't that much bigger than them at all when it comes down to it, not in terms of generating revenue anyway, so we'd be as limited as they are in what they are able to do.  We 'wasted' money recently because we got to the Premier League.  We got to the Premier League by doing the opposite of what Brentford do.  Brentford have yet to get there.

Him investing money has nothing to do with their transfer income.  That's not how it (FFP and business finance) works.  An owner can put as much money into his business as he likes, it's just that the money cannot be spent in certain areas, which fall under the FFP regulations.  He's still loaned the club a sizeable sum of money.  It's no different to what Gibson has done, it's just that Gibson has being doing it a lot longer and obviously in a different time when you could do as you saw fit, so he went for it with us on a bigger scale.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, RealSlimSladeyy said:

1) Brentford have had six seasons in the championship and are going into their seventh.

2) Their basic strategy has been in place the entire time. 

3) Brentford's ultimate goal with said strategy is promotion to the premier league.

Therefore, it will have taken them at least seven seasons for their model to bear fruit.

That's what I mean. Although there are obvious flaws with my question. I guess it assumes us and Brentford would have the same starting position which is obviously impossible. But I'll maintain my basic point that their overarching strategy of incremental progress would test boro fans.

I think, if we came out as a club, in an official capacity (not an op-ed looking piece in the Gazette) and said that we were going to attempt to adopt a model where we revamp the scouting system, and show that to be the case, and where we buy exciting young players low and sell high, and pln to play free flowing, attacking football.. and that this would mean we may lose big players but we could slowly build a squad over multiple seasons to a point where we were challenging at the top of the league, with the end goal being established in the Prem, and that we hoped to do it in 5-7 seasons but that we were committed to it, even if it takes 10 or more years (a la Brentford and even Leicester, who seem to make one big sale a season but improve multiple areas of the squad with that money).....

Fans would take that. Yes there would be a vocal minority, but just knowing the club had a long term strategy, a vision that goes beyond the end of this season would be a huge upgrade on what we have currently. 

And then, after the first year doesn't go our way, and the second year, if we are shown to stick with our goals and not give up hope and start spunking money on 35 year old journeymen, you would start to win over that vocal minority when they see the club does indeed have a plan and that this wasnt all just a bunch of talk

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah id hate us to scout the whole of Europe and sign players who instantly terrorise the league for less than £2m and sell them on for 15x that in just a few seasons too!

Do brentford not know they could've signed George Saville for £7m?! We've been in the prem and they haven't so we obviously we do it better and there weren't other factors as well as transfers that determined our promotion!

Jokes on Ajax, Liverpool, Porto, Benfica, Sporting Lisbon, The Red Bull Clubs, FC Midtjylland, etc theyll have to scrap their strategy because Brentford haven't been promoted to the Prem for the first time in their history yet

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Changing Times said:

If we had the same approach as Brentford we would be no better off than Brentford, which would be failure for us because we want to be in the Premier League.  I'm not bothered about what they want, I'm bothered about what we want.  I'm saying that they have failed to achieve the things that we are trying to achieve, not that they have been failures in themselves, so why would we want to emulate them?

You seem to have convinced yourself that if we did the same thing as them that we would somehow be better off than them and that doesn't make any sense.  What makes you think that if we operated in the same way that we would somehow be better off with it?  Being a bigger club is irrelevant if you are operating in the same way and frankly we aren't that much bigger than them at all when it comes down to it, not in terms of generating revenue anyway, so we'd be as limited as they are in what they are able to do.  We 'wasted' money recently because we got to the Premier League.  We got to the Premier League by doing the opposite of what Brentford do.  Brentford have yet to get there.

Him investing money has nothing to do with their transfer income.  That's not how it (FFP and business finance) works.  An owner can put as much money into his business as he likes, it's just that the money cannot be spent in certain areas, which fall under the FFP regulations.  He's still loaned the club a sizeable sum of money.  It's no different to what Gibson has done, it's just that Gibson has being doing it a lot longer and obviously in a different time when you could do as you saw fit, so he went for it with us on a bigger scale.

the same approach used by different clubs dosent garner the same outcome, as iv started numerous times were both in different positions, for example if boro and wycombe both employed the money ball method, our outcome after 5 years would be most likley be different as we are a bigger club with more money and more pulling power for signing, we have better facilities etc etc.  basically were in a better starting position. This applies to your second point also in that brentford have used this method for several years now to go from league 1 to championship playoff final final, since were already an established championship i doubt it would take us as long to achieve to the same. 

also on the second point i agree that financially we are not much better off anymore, which highlights the success of the money ball method which they Incorporated, a rich owner helps, but you still have to balance the books on the filed in signings and contracts and they been very efficient at doing that. a club that was in league 1 5 years ago has generated over 60 million in profit through transfers in that time. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, tmcc said:

the same approach used by different clubs dosent garner the same outcome, as iv started numerous times were both in different positions, for example if boro and wycombe both employed the money ball method, our outcome after 5 years would be most likley be different as we are a bigger club with more money and more pulling power for signing, we have better facilities etc etc.  basically were in a better starting position. This applies to your second point also in that brentford have used this method for several years now to go from league 1 to championship playoff final final, since were already an established championship i doubt it would take us as long to achieve to the same. 

also on the second point i agree that financially we are not much better off anymore, which highlights the success of the money ball method which they Incorporated, a rich owner helps, but you still have to balance the books on the filed in signings and contracts and they been very efficient at doing that. a club that was in league 1 5 years ago has generated over 60 million in profit through transfers in that time. 

 

But Brentford aren't in a different position now.  They've been at this level for a few years and until last season they really hadn't done that much at all.  In fact, they were in the play offs with us in 2014/15.  Since then we've been promoted and they've been midtable.  Until last season they'd made no progress at all.  If we'd been doing the same things as them then there's no reason to think we'd be better off than they are.  Go back in time to 2014/15, we lose in the play off final, and then we sell our better players and buy some projects from wherever.  Do we get promoted in 2015/16?  I don't think we do.  We don't spend heavily on Downing, Rhodes, Nugent, Stuani (possibly a good thing on balance) but we sell the likes of Tomlin, Friend, Adomah, Clayton, because that's how our model works.  Just like Brentford we fall down the table rather than move up and we miss out on promotion.  Then we do the same thing again. 

You're making an assumption that last season will be bettered, which might be the case but then again it might not be.  It's a fact that last season was the first time in donkeys years that they've finished ahead of us.  I'd have a decent bet that they finish ahead of us again this season, given our own situation, but unless that comes with promotion then what does it matter?  They are in the Championship still.  The £60m transfer profit is fine but I've already said that I don't care about that.  If my team makes a healthy profit on transfers and then finishes 11th, what about that is good for me as a fan?  Over the last 2 years we've made a profit of £31m on transfers, it didn't do us much good on the field though, and I can't say that it made me feel great to be a Boro fan.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Borodane changed the title to The Summer/Autumn transfers thread 2020 (playing the Chuba?)

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×
×
  • Create New...