Neil Warnock, Steve Gibson & Long Term Vision?

[RiseAgainst 3,793]

I know this has been argued about on here before, but you can be opposed to racial inequality without supporting BLM. That movement has some extremists attached to it who have rather subverted its original intentions, and the various strands constituting BLM are hard to disentangle.

I deplore bigotry and intolerance (I've suffered it myself for much of my life), but I also dislike BLM's militancy. Both statements can be true at the same time.

[Changing Times 12,339]

40 minutes ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

I'm not bothered that the club has chosen to stop taking the knee, it's entirely up to them how they support BLM. But when people attack Lewis Hamilton for using his platform as best F1 driver in history (arguably) to highlight racial inequality, it makes it quite difficult to assume anything other than they think it's a bad thing.

I don't think sanddancer did attack him, unless you mean someone else?

[Changing Times 12,339]

22 minutes ago, RiseAgainst said:

I know this has been argued about on here before, but you can be opposed to racial inequality without supporting BLM. That movement has some extremists attached to it who have rather subverted its original intentions, and the various strands constituting BLM are hard to disentangle.

I deplore bigotry and intolerance (I've suffered it myself for much of my life), but I also dislike BLM's militancy. Both statements can be true at the same time.

I've suffered plenty of intolerance on here but I'm probably too white to matter 😭

[RiseAgainst 3,793]

7 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

I've suffered plenty of intolerance on here but I'm probably too white to matter 😭

#formergazettejournalistslivesmatter

[Denzel Zanzibar 6,972]

51 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

I don't think sanddancer did attack him, unless you mean someone else?

On 2/20/2021 at 9:28 PM, sanddancer said:

I was a big fan of Hamilton because I liked his story, his rise, success, dedication and ability but I totally switched off once he started dictating to others. It’s amazing to see how personality changes with success and money. I guess it’s true you can’t buy class. 

 

I'd class that as attacking him, wouldn't you? If anything it's certainly an assault on his character.

[Changing Times 12,339]

29 minutes ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

On 2/20/2021 at 9:28 PM, sanddancer said:

I was a big fan of Hamilton because I liked his story, his rise, success, dedication and ability but I totally switched off once he started dictating to others. It’s amazing to see how personality changes with success and money. I guess it’s true you can’t buy class. 

 

I'd class that as attacking him, wouldn't you? If anything it's certainly an assault on his character.

No, not really.  I also wouldn't call it an assault on his character either.  His opinion of the man changed, that's all, as he perceived Hamilton's own behaviour to have changed.  There are lots of people who don't really want to hear from celebrities on any issues, whether that's sports people, actors, musicians, etc.  I know I don't give a toss what they think about stuff, why would I?  And indeed why would anyone?  However, I'm not on social media following some of these people, so I suppose that plays a part in my lack of interest in general and others who are would be more interested - but not everyone.

[wilsoncgp 9,281]

47 minutes ago, RiseAgainst said:

I know this has been argued about on here before, but you can be opposed to racial inequality without supporting BLM. That movement has some extremists attached to it who have rather subverted its original intentions, and the various strands constituting BLM are hard to disentangle.

I deplore bigotry and intolerance (I've suffered it myself for much of my life), but I also dislike BLM's militancy. Both statements can be true at the same time.

You can but I also feel like in my experience, people who take that kind of stance are plenty more willing to talk about the problems extremists cause as opposed to the reason they exist to begin with, though I'm not saying that's the case with you in particular.

We saw it with Extinction Rebellion too, more talk about the actions they took than why they feel it is necessary to take them. Apparently its their fault for undermining their own aims, so sayeth those who ultimately aren't being affected by those issues right now. Green extremists are concerned with the future of the planet, we have to take continuous preventative action to avoid a literal global disaster that could wipe out our entire species but their actions were framed by media as practically psychopathic. A Telegraph writer called it 'economic terrorism', referencing people who couldn't get to work or go on holiday. Imagine the kind of real problems disrupting transport causes and picking out those things as the issue? People just don't seem to have time for extremists no matter how extreme their cause really is.

[RiseAgainst 3,793]

There's a difference between an extreme situation and am extreme human reaction to it. I agree the planet is dying through overpopulation and rapacious consumerism, but sabotage is hardly going to win the debate.

Racism is very different as it's a human construct, but I still think there's a lot more public focus on the problems of bigotry than on the flaws of those fighting to eradicate it. I criticise BLM because I disapprove of some of their attitudes (abolish the police, etc), but that doesn't mean I'm oblivious to the entrenched attitudes they stand up against. 

[AnglianRed 6,320]

24 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said:

You can but I also feel like in my experience, people who take that kind of stance are plenty more willing to talk about the problems extremists cause as opposed to the reason they exist to begin with, though I'm not saying that's the case with you in particular.

We saw it with Extinction Rebellion too, more talk about the actions they took than why they feel it is necessary to take them. Apparently its their fault for undermining their own aims, so sayeth those who ultimately aren't being affected by those issues right now. Green extremists are concerned with the future of the planet, we have to take continuous preventative action to avoid a literal global disaster that could wipe out our entire species but their actions were framed by media as practically psychopathic. A Telegraph writer called it 'economic terrorism', referencing people who couldn't get to work or go on holiday. Imagine the kind of real problems disrupting transport causes and picking out those things as the issue? People just don't seem to have time for extremists no matter how extreme their cause really is.

Well in order to get support for a cause, you have to make people sympathetic towards you.

I'm not sure how you expect to achieve that by *** people off and generally messing up their daily lives...which is largely all Extinction Rebellion did.

When you get people willing to put their own (and potentially other peoples') lives at risk like that lunatic who climbed on the roof of a tube train, as well as spreading blatantly inaccurate scaremongering stories that fly in the face of established facts, all you're doing is undermining any sympathy and support for a very important and worthwhile cause.

In effect they did way more harm than good.

What they should have done was target governments directly (and stuck to the truth), not unlike how Greta Thunberg did. Instead their actions came off as annoying, infantile, half-arsed virtue signalling.

 

[TLF10 4,496]

I am not sure if this the right place to make this comment and apologies if its been said before but it does appear increasingly likely NW will be here next season and I look out for little hints in what he says.

Today during press conference when asked about if he worried about Fletcher wanting to wait until end of season before deciding if he signs new deal Warnock said “i am not worried at all. I will find a replacement for him. I will be looking to sign a new striker anyway”. 

[Snake 45]

5 hours ago, Will said:

Hamilton would beat Russell just as he has beaten all of his teammates past and present. The idea that the only reason Hamilton wins is because of the car is, frankly, stupid.

How long did it take you to come up with that hardly reasoned argument?

[sanddancer 1,967]

10 hours ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Because you brought it up? To be quite frank I think it's a good thing that Lewis Hamilton uses his platform to inspire more black drivers to enter F1, while highlighting racial injustice in the world at the same time. 

But hey, I suppose in your little world

I didn’t you have and unfortunately in your world your suggesting I am a racist because I don’t agree in the way some highlight injustice. The thing being you have no idea of my experience, mentoring or life I live.  Hell you poor soul I pity you, I do. 

[Denzel Zanzibar 6,972]

1 hour ago, sanddancer said:

 

[Denzel Zanzibar 6,972]

1 hour ago, sanddancer said:

I didn’t you have and unfortunately in your world your suggesting I am a racist because I don’t agree in the way some highlight injustice. The thing being you have no idea of my experience, mentoring or life I live.  Hell you poor soul I pity you, I do. 

I know you're getting old mate but come on, you mentioned Lewis Hamilton first.

No need to pity me pal, I'm quite happy living my life not criticising people who speak out about racial inequality.

[sanddancer 1,967]

53 minutes ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

I know you're getting old mate but come on, you mentioned Lewis Hamilton first.

No need to pity me pal, I'm quite happy living my life not criticising people who speak out about racial inequality.

Its people like you that lump labels on others but know little, nothing or care then enforcing your views. 
Let’s forget you now think ageism a handicap.   
I married a Asian decades ago at the height of racism. I have adult children who were labeled half chats and given many other labels but we never wavered as a family. We never demanded respect or equality, we never protested or disrespected or labeled others because there views differed from ours. We have a large close circle of family and friends across a broad national spectrum in many parts of the world, why because we each accept we are different in colour, IQ, views, gender, age, shape, humor etc. I have met, we have met people like you we don’t particularly feel comfortable around but will tolerate simply because one day you will educate yourself to accept you can’t enforce or impose your agenda on others. Equality is not a given specific category, a subject a tick box or measured, it’s acceptance of all regardless my friend.. 

I have said more then I wanted on the subject and exposed more about my family then comfortable,  I will avoid further comments on the subject because I feel equality is being stifled by association of, either wholly agree or you oppose equality.  

Edited February 22, 2021 by sanddancer