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Neil Warnock, Steve Gibson & Long Term Vision?


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Think 'short term' is a more realistic discussion. Last time I looked at football odds, Newcastle 7/4 to go down, Sunderland 9/5 to come up and Boro 33/1 to go up.

So 6 games for tv maybe.

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As it's looking a virtual certainty that Warnock is going to get the job for next season, it's worth noting both the significant positives and negatives that will result from Warnock being our manager

👀Thanks for the invite, really appreciate it.

The Evening Gazette has said that Steve Gibson is against a director of football because it would add another 6 figure salary onto the wage bill. I can't help but question whether that is the true mot

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9 hours ago, Brunners said:

he actually did that without seeing any of the Bamford money. IIRC, we didn't see much of anything for a year of the Bamford money.

Pulis sold Bamford and brought in Saville just four weeks later over July/August 2018. 

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6 hours ago, p_mards said:

It's just a lot more complicated than that though. Pulis played with just one striker - ideally a targetman - yet he took over a team with the forward options of (estimated fees and wages): Assombalonga: £15 million fee, £40k a week with 3 and a half years remaining (£7.28 million in wages); Braithwaite: £10 million fee, £40k a week with 3 and a half years remaining (£7.28 million in wages); Fletcher: £7 million fee, £30k a week with 3 and a half years remaining (£5.46 million in wages); Gestede: £6 million fee, £30k a week with 2 and a half years remaining (£3.9 million in wages); Bamford: £7 million fee, £30k a week with 3 and a half year remaining (£5.46 million in wages).

So whilst they're back of a packet of fags estimates, that's roughly £45 million in transfer fees and £29.38 million in wages: so £74.38 million combined. I dread to imagine what that would have looked like to our accountant, especially when our parachute payments ran out. To me it's abundantly clear that having the astonishing amount of money tied up in 5 forwards - 4 of which nobody else wanted -  would create the financial pressure to sell the one saleable asset who was our best forward, Bamford. It's also important to note that the last of our parachute payments were expiring at the end of the 2018/2019 season with 2 years remaining on Assombalonga, Braithwaite, Fletcher and Bamford, and one year remaining on Gestede. When the parachute payments expired, we simply wouldn't be able to sustain the bloated wages of our many forwards as it would leave us incredibly short in many other areas of the team such as midfield and defence. There was a huge financial gap that needed to be plugged. Bamford was therefore unfortunately sacrificed.

Whilst Pulis done an abysmal job in the 2018/19 season, I'm confident that his primary aims during his time here were: 1.) to sort the financial mess, especially with so much long-term budget committed to forwards; 2.) strengthen the team throughout all areas of the squad that he thought needed extra quality added, such as Saville who he was hoping was going to be a box-to-box goalscoring midfielder and McNair at CB.

Therefore, whilst I'm gutted about us selling Bamford, I can understand why Pulis did it in the financial circumstances. The blame for selling Bamford lies in Gibson's hands for not acting more responsibly in the way we had a scattergun approach to signing them 4 inferior forwards, which we shouldn't have touched at them prices and wages in our circumstances. It's in them circumstances that a competent Director of Football, like Orta did at Leeds, would have built a defensively solid and creative team around Bamford and not wasted so much money on inferior strikers - which created the financial pressure to sell him.

Whilst there is no doubt there is some truth in all that Pulis refused to play Bamford until he had to and then it was Bamford's goals that got us into the play offs. Bamford got concussed just before them after landing on his back in a game and was taken to the hospital as a precaution, he returned to the Riverside quickly the same afternoon seemingly without serious after effects. He was then seemingly dispensed with by Pulis who instead reverted to his non scoring strikers and those two spineless games against Villa saw Bamford ignored with even an injured Gestede preferred.

A chance to reach the Premiership and £120 to £150 Million to swell the coffers and our best and most capable Striker was ignored. Had Pulis played Paddy against Villa Gibson and the accountants might not have had to worry that summer about finances at all.

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8 hours ago, Redcar Rioja said:

Pulis sold Bamford and brought in Saville just four weeks later over July/August 2018. 

Yes, but what I'm saying is we didn't get anything from Leeds for Bamford at time of sale.

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1 hour ago, Brunners said:

Yes, but what I'm saying is we didn't get anything from Leeds for Bamford at time of sale.

We like as not didn't pay cash up front for Saville, most deals are structured over a multitude of different arrangements but the point is we were supposedly skint and on the bones of our backside so we sold Bamford for a rumoured £7m (it was undisclosed) yet brought Saville in four weeks later for a similar amount of that commonly touted as the amount we received for Bamford. 

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20 hours ago, Brunners said:

he actually did that without seeing any of the Bamford money. IIRC, we didn't see much of anything for a year of the Bamford money.

Whats your point? What difference does that make? We got the money.

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3 hours ago, Brunners said:

Yes, but what I'm saying is we didn't get anything from Leeds for Bamford at time of sale.

I don't think it matters too much when we got the funds tbh mate. IIRC at the time, the deal was up to £10m with about £7m of that confirmed to be coming in at some stage and around £3m of add-ons. None of that money came in immediately IIRC but we always knew at least £7m was coming in at some point.

So whilst we wouldn't have been able to immediately give Millwall £7m for Saville direct from the Bamford fee, we did have freedom to negotiate spending £7m knowing full well we'd end up with the money from Bamford at some stage. The only thing the delayed transaction might have hindered us doing is paying all of the money up front, which I imagine most multi-million pound transfers don't really come to these days anyway.

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5 hours ago, Humpty said:

That’s purely an accounting practise issue. The sale is recorded and is as good as having the funds in the bank. 

It really isn't as good as having the funds in the bank mate.  You either have money or you don't, and you can't spend what you don't have.  In this case though we took out a loan against the future payments we were going to receive for Bamford, to get access to the money sooner.  Of course you have to pay for the loan so you don't end up seeing the full amount either way.

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7 hours ago, Humpty said:

Thanks for going in to the detail to explain why it is as good as having the funds in the bank 👍

Taking out a loan is.  Agreeing a sale or transfer, isn't. 

On an unrelated subject, are you a professional writer mate?

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5 minutes ago, Humpty said:

Why do you ask?

He’s looking for someone to put together a biography of his wittiness on oneBoro

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Wouldn't need a professional writer to carry out that task. My 6 year old nephew however has mastered his own name, he should be free...

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