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19 hours ago, DanFromDownSouth said:

Refugees seeking asylum in the UK cannot be penalised for entering the UK without permission, if they are seeking asylum and are coming from place where their life/freedom is threatened. Where the misinterpretation comes is people crossing the Channel are technically coming from France, which to many is deemed a "safe" country. But back in the late 90's a UK court agreed refugees should have some degree of choice in which country they want to seek asylum in. 

So in theory yes they are entering the country without permission, but if they seek asylum as soon as they arrive then it is not illegal. But anyway, let focus on the Boro, who have just conceded (Shock - not really a shock).

Except I would bet a good chunk of money the majority are actually economic migrants.

We saw the same thing during the mass migrations to Greece and Italy a few years back. The smugglers they pay to arrange the boats, tell them to pose as asylum seekers, otherwise they'll just get sent straight back. In some cases they even provided forged IDs. I remember this from BBC news programmes where the reporters interviewed some "asylum seekers" who openly admitted they were actually just looking for work.

Call me a cynical old ***, but I have a hard time believing that many people are genuinely at risk of death. As we have seen on numerous and tragic occasions, they're actually more likely to die during their attempts to get here. Undoubtedly SOME will be genuine...but I would bet a large number are not. 

As for freedom...well the Middle East and large parts of Africa have never exactly been beacons of freedom and tolerance. Why are we only now seeing such vast numbers trying to get into Europe?

Incidentally, these people have to...and somehow manage to...pay extortionate amounts to the smugglers, so its not like they have no money either.

I would love to see the UK and Europe take a much harder line on illegal immigration. But then that would mean us working collectively with their countries of origin to promote economic growth and make them more desirable places to live and work. Give people less reason to migrate in the first place. Given the EU member states haven't been able to co-operate over the last few years to deal with the migrant crisis, I don't see that happening any time soon.

So, in a nutshell, there is no solution to the problem, due to Europe's general ineptitude.

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Can this be moved to the transfer thread.

This is why we do things by DM. Comments like these don’t add to the situation🤦‍♂️

To err is human.....let him that is without sin...forgive us our trespasses....we all say things that we don't think through...and the main thing in life is to try not to repeat our mistakes...if Barn

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21 minutes ago, macapes said:

You are not tested/checked for COVID when entering the country under any circumstances, legal or not. 

The hundreds of thousands of Brits happily holidaying across Europe (and the sheer number who won't quatantine after) and coming home are clearly a far higher risk for bringing it in than a few hundred refugees. 

The suggestion that refugees are somehow responsible for the pandemic continuing is itself is racist. 

 

Yes this pandemic has nothing to do with refugees, and its going to be even harder to get rid of COVID when you have idiots holding street parties, and raves, without very little punishment, then you have ignoramuses who refuse to social distance and walk in and out of shops without masks on, and there's nothing done about it. 

I honestly don't feel sorry for the Brits holidaying abroad who have to quarantine when arriving back in Britain, if a fortnight in the sun is that important to them in the middle of a Pandemic then tough. I cancelled my holiday to Crete, in the realm of things it didn't seem that important to me.   

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It’s a massively difficult situation. I know 100% that if the UK wasn’t safe for my family I’d be on the first plane, train or automobile to a safe place of residence without hesitation. However like everything that is a good idea. It’s open to abuse. These people smugglers that risk the lives of those in need for £1000’s with no real repercussions are the absolute scum of the earth. That’s who we need to crack down on. As well as the people that are manipulating a situation just for work or even in some cases crime opportunities. 
The media once again have their party to play in causing hysteria or at the very least animosity towards migrants/asylum seekers (not refugees as that’s a whole different ball of chalk)  and should hang their heads in shame 

Millions off migrants have settled in the UK and been an absolute credit to it. IMO the nhs would be on it’s *** if not for the foreign workers employed within it and I’d continue to welcome them with open arms. We have a lot more homegrown Problems that are a ‘drain’ on our resources than immigration that we should be looking a lot harder at and calling them out on it. 

It’s just near on impossible and very time consuming to weed out the small percentage of them that look to exploit the UK and it is massively over reported in the national media. 
To conclude, I wouldn’t even know where to begin

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11 hours ago, AnglianRed said:

Except I would bet a good chunk of money the majority are actually economic migrants.

We saw the same thing during the mass migrations to Greece and Italy a few years back. The smugglers they pay to arrange the boats, tell them to pose as asylum seekers, otherwise they'll just get sent straight back. In some cases they even provided forged IDs. I remember this from BBC news programmes where the reporters interviewed some "asylum seekers" who openly admitted they were actually just looking for work.

Call me a cynical old ***, but I have a hard time believing that many people are genuinely at risk of death. As we have seen on numerous and tragic occasions, they're actually more likely to die during their attempts to get here. Undoubtedly SOME will be genuine...but I would bet a large number are not. 

As for freedom...well the Middle East and large parts of Africa have never exactly been beacons of freedom and tolerance. Why are we only now seeing such vast numbers trying to get into Europe?

Incidentally, these people have to...and somehow manage to...pay extortionate amounts to the smugglers, so its not like they have no money either.

I would love to see the UK and Europe take a much harder line on illegal immigration. But then that would mean us working collectively with their countries of origin to promote economic growth and make them more desirable places to live and work. Give people less reason to migrate in the first place. Given the EU member states haven't been able to co-operate over the last few years to deal with the migrant crisis, I don't see that happening any time soon.

So, in a nutshell, there is no solution to the problem, due to Europe's general ineptitude.

In theory all asylum seekers are economic migrants. They've left a country in order to improve their standard of living (the definition of an economic migrant). Even so if they are economic migrants and they gain employment in the UK it's likely that they'll more than likely end up paying the same tax as we do, so I'm not sure what the issue is. 

There's no doubting that there probably is a small proportion of people that are looking to come to Greece, Italy and the UK looking for an "easy ride", but I highly doubt it is a large chunk. To put things into perspective benefit fraud in the UK cost £4.1 Billion in 18/19, and I hate to break it to you, but the vast majority of that was not caused by economic migrants or asylum seekers.

Unfortunately I'm sure the asylum seekers that have left places like Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq were certainly at risk of death in their own countries. Syria has been in the grip of Civil war which has raged since 2011. An estimated 500,000 people have been killed in this conflict, Syria had a population of 21 million in 2010. Or to put it plainly 1 in 50 Syrians have been killed, but that isn't genuine danger? 

Unfortunately we are largely to blame for a lot of the instability within the Middle East and Africa. For nearly 30 years we have been directly involved in conflict in the Middle East, infrastructure in those countries has basically been wiped out due to perpetual conflict that we have been involved in. This isn't also a "New problem" in 2000 there was an estimated 23 Million refugees globally, in a recent estimate that figure is close to 30 million, of which half are children.

The last paragraph you've written there are elements I agree with. The part about the UK taking a harder stance, is fairly difficult to agree with as the UK is incredibly hardline already. Just over 50% of asylum claims are actually accepted, which is low compared to other nations. In 2018 the UK only had around 37,000 asylum claims in 2017 France had around 100,000.

You are right we do need to work closely with nations were these asylum seekers are coming from in order to improve their countries of origin. But in some places that is incredibly difficult due to conflict taking place (Syria, Afghanistan etc...).

1 solution I can think of to help reduce the Channel crossings is to set something up over in France that allows people to claim asylum from France. Rather than needing to cross into the UK to then make a claim, which they legally need to be in the UK to make a claim in the first place. I also can't remember who else said it on this thread, but we certainly need a hardline stance on the criminal aspect of this, the people smugglers, gangs etc, not the people trying to claim asylum.

There is no malice in this post at all but I am merely putting my opinion across. ❤️

Edited by DanFromDownSouth
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Historically, this country has always attracted economic migrants ...Normans, Vikings, Angles, Saxons, Romans (what did they ever do for us) and each time we probably blamed them for taking the best jobs and grabbing the desirable housing...the real Brits are supposedly the Welsh .....and all that happened is we lulled them into a false sense of security, got them drunk, married their daughters , called ourselves English and created a language that is a mixture of Latin, Norse, Arabic, German, French, Indian, Malay, Chinese, Spanish (muy bad), Afrikaans, Algonquin, and worst of all, Irish...(craicers)...if it is acceptable for people to represent this country at cricket, rugby, athletics, after living here for a few years then how can you gripe at others coming to do jobs people turn their noses up at ...    

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