Boro V Millwall 3-0 (Watmore (2) Tavernier)

[TLF10 4,498]

@diggerlad07. Interesting point you make about Akpom needing a target man to play to his potential. You think Fletcher could work alongside one of Britt or Akpom?

I did not really see Fletcher as a target man but Warnock does and looking at his goals last season half were with his head?

[Kelloe 18]

4 hours ago, Changing Times said:

I still think Warnock should resign and I'd be happy with Gibson selling the club as well.  No idea what those two things have to do with the team selection before the game though?  My opinion on those things certainly hasn't changed because of the win today.  See, if we played decent football week in week out then I'd be happy with the manager but as we don't then doing it once in a while isn't enough.

Bettenelli has been poor and I'd be more than happy with him being dropped.  If you think he was key to us winning the game today then I can only assume you didn't actually watch it. 

You are an idiot son.

[Blanco 4,917]

2 hours ago, Neverbefore said:

I thought you'd be raging that we dared trying to score again after we went 1-0 up 😉

I have no problem with scoring goals. I have a major issue with conceding them. Simples

[Changing Times 12,347]

47 minutes ago, Kelloe said:

You are an idiot son.

Well, that's me told 😭

I believe that's checkmate, well played Kelloe 🤝

[J.T. 640]

2 hours ago, Kelloe said:

You are an idiot son.

A very convincing argument, I must say. 
 

On this day, 2 years ago, Tony Pulis was managing us. We were sat 6th in the table (we are currently 9th) with a better goals per game ratio than we currently have and the majority of fans wanted Pulis gone. Yet now, you’re deemed an idiot for saying the same about Warnock. 
 

Steve Gibson is an absolute genius. In the space of 2 years he has managed to lower expectations so much so, that what was was deemed unacceptable 2 years ago, is now considered heroic. 

[sackrobson2 371]

Great result and sounds like a good performance too. The players and manager deserve credit today even if the opposition were terrible.  

I think most of us on here don’t like the midfield 3 of Howson, Saville and Morsy as it’s too similar and today was a massive improvement with only two of them in there. I hope he doesn’t go back to it.  I wonder what our points per game are playing the three together against only playing two of them.  
 

 

[Changing Times 12,347]

54 minutes ago, sackrobson2 said:

Great result and sounds like a good performance too. The players and manager deserve credit today even if the opposition were terrible.  

I think most of us on here don’t like the midfield 3 of Howson, Saville and Morsy as it’s too similar and today was a massive improvement with only two of them in there. I hope he doesn’t go back to it.  I wonder what our points per game are playing the three together against only playing two of them.  
 

 

It's pretty close tbh.  It's slightly complicated by the fact that a couple of times Morsy has either come on with a chunk of a game to play or come off with a chunk of the game to play.  Roughly it works out to 14 points in 9 games with 2 of them on, 12 points in 8 games with all 3 of them on, and 1 point from 1 game where we only had one of them on (Brentford).  So that would be 1.55 points per game with 2 and 1.5 points per game with all 3.  It's not massively different really but slightly favours 2. 

Interestingly (or not), with only 2 of them playing we've conceded 7 goals in 9 games, and with all 3 we've conceded 7 in 8 games, so there doesn't appear to be any difference to our defensive solidity with 2 or 3 playing.  However we've scored 12 with 2 of them on but only 7 with all 3 of them, and that's despite playing Watford, Bournemouth and Norwich with just 2 of them.  In fact, we've only won 1 game against a decent side when all 3 have played (Bristol City).  But to be fair, we've only beaten 2 decent sides this season - Bristol City and Swansea - so it's difficult to read too much into that.

[Changing Times 12,347]

3 hours ago, Blanco said:

I have no problem with scoring goals. I have a major issue with conceding them. Simples

Then you would appear to be exact opposite of Boro 🙂

[Changing Times 12,347]

1 hour ago, J.T. said:

A very convincing argument, I must say. 
 

On this day, 2 years ago, Tony Pulis was managing us. We were sat 6th in the table (we are currently 9th) with a better goals per game ratio than we currently have and the majority of fans wanted Pulis gone. Yet now, you’re deemed an idiot for saying the same about Warnock. 
 

Steve Gibson is an absolute genius. In the space of 2 years he has managed to lower expectations so much so, that what was was deemed unacceptable 2 years ago, is now considered heroic. 

If you look at the squads it's not even that different really although Pulis had a bigger squad to work with certainly, and that had to give him an advantage.  Fry, Howson, Saville, McNair, Wing, Tavernier, Assombalonga, Fletcher are all still here. 

Dijksteel replaces Shotton, Bola replaces Friend, Bettenelli replaces Randolph, Morsy replaces Clayton, Akpom replaces Hugill.  Out of those, I'd rather Dijksteel than Shotton, Morsy than Clayton and probably even Bola over Friend, although Clayton and Friend of 5 years ago would walk into the side of course.  The pair of them from the season before last though, I really don't think they would.  Randolph definitely gets in ahead of Bettenelli for me all day long, Akpom and Hugill I can't separate at the moment.  I don't think either impressed in a Boro shirt.

Then you have Ayala, Braithwaite, Downing, Mikel, Besic, Flint.  Braithwaite obviously didn't play much and Mikel signed in January so played only after then.  Downing played a decent number of games but then we had that daft period where we couldn't pick him cos of his contract.  Replacing that lot you have Hall, Spence, Coulson, Watmore, Roberts, Johnson and Browne I guess. 

Ayala beats Hall without question.  I prefer McNair to Flint at the back but I wasn't much of a fan of Flint in fairness.  We don't really have anyone to replace Mikel and Besic, although I suppose that was one of the criticisms back then that we had too many central midfielders, now it feels like we're a bit short.  Braithwaite is a better player than any of those mentioned but didn't play much, and didn't make much of an impact on the season, but he did get 3 goals in 12 games or so.  Johnson didn't play at all that season and obviously has played this season, and has actually contributed more than Braithwaite or Downing.  Not quite sure where to put Watmore as he has barely played but 4 goals is more than than Downing or Braithwaite got that season.  The others aren't really like for like I guess so it's hard to compare them.  I'd say that overall the squad then wasn't significantly bette than this one but it was bigger and that had to count for something over the course of a season.

[diggerlad07 3,695]

9 hours ago, TLF10 said:

@diggerlad07. Interesting point you make about Akpom needing a target man to play to his potential. You think Fletcher could work alongside one of Britt or Akpom?

I did not really see Fletcher as a target man but Warnock does and looking at his goals last season half were with his head?

Personally, Yeah I can see them working together.

Akpom's main strength is commiting defenders and getting them in 1 on 1 situation, where unfortunately we are using him with his back to the goal and as a target man.

Fletch can be that target man because he's got the physical presence, good in the air and has good link up play. 

 

[Duvel 2,446]

We played Millwall at home under Pulis who were in similar poor form. We drew 1-1 with a last minute penalty and it was one of the most negative performances I've seen in my life against a team we should have stuffed.  We had 5 defenders on the pitch,  4 central midfielders and Hugill up front.

Thats why I wanted him out, it was nothing to do with league position. Warnock is defensive but nowt like Pulis. 

[Downsouth 6,328]

9 hours ago, Kelloe said:

You are an idiot son.

I found that so amusing for anyone to call CT son, even I would not being my age!😄

[Downsouth 6,328]

Aspects of Akpoms general playing ability came to the fore today, not a natural finisher though it has to be said but he could work better with Fletcher.

Talking of which, have we scored a header since his last headed goal? struggling to think if we have as they are so rare it seems these days

[AnglianRed 6,320]

13 hours ago, J.T. said:

Do you think he would have went with the team and tactics he did today it Howson had been fit?

I do have my suspicions that we actually performed better because NW's hand was forced. But lets see how he sets us up against Luton.

[RiseAgainst 3,793]

For many years, Boro fans have complained about underperforming strikers. And for many of those years, we've played one up front. Karanka did it, Pulis did it and both got pilloried for it. It never played to the strengths of players like Bamford, Hugill or Britt - making their weaknesses as strikers all the more glaring.

I fail to see why anyone (including Neil Warnock himself) would oppose us playing two up front in most games from now on, especially since the statistics quoted above show no improvement in our performance with one, two or three largely defensive midfielders in the starting XI. We have limited strikers who seem to play better with a partner alongside them. So why not make the most of what we've got, and start Britt and Akpom in every game til Fletcher returns or we sign someone next month?