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Dan's Summer Transfer Thread. Aka: " Post Mortem Time""


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Offer has been accepted bauser has had his critics but he has pulled masterstrokes on both of these.  Now over to you Leo!  Payero small issues look sorted should be an announcement tomorrow or f

Gibson doing a Gibson. Having another punt, pushing for Bolasie, this Argentinian and money available for a couple more. (Not a lot though) Spence going for £5m

Not been keeping up but Sporar should be sorted by Tuesday 

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6 hours ago, Changing Times said:

It would amount to the same thing - Gibson driving transfers.  If you say there is X amount to do your shopping in one supermarket but more available to shop in a different one then where are you more likely to want to do your shopping?  It's what Gibson did with Downing, with Rhodes, probably with a few other players we're not even aware of in that context. To me it's obvious that it goes on here, it's just a question of whether you view it as a bad thing or not.

I don't think it does amount to the same thing though.

If Gibson was willing to spend £2m on a foreign gem, but only willing to spend £1m on a lower league player, that doesn't meant Gibson is forcing players on a manager.

It just means he's more willing to spend on certain players.

Every single owner at every single club is driving transfers to that extent.

If Warnock didn't want Payero, I'm sure we wouldn't sign him.

I'd sooner spend more on a steak than a pizza, it doesn't mean I'm forcing my partner to get steak.

Edited by TeaCider24
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The South American signings would no doubt be a risk but I think they also have the potential of a big sell on profit which is probably why Gibson is prepared to pay a bit more for these than for lower league players.

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Just been reading on a Flamengo forum that there was a tipping issue in a restaurant called Simplesmente Vermelho with our future Brazilian star. 
The club have put a confidentiality clause in place so they can’t talk openly about it.

Apparently Muniz is too tight to mention.


 

boom tish! 
i thank you 

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17 hours ago, p_mards said:

After my early question marks regarding us targeting Payero, I'm intrigued by Warnock's quotes within the Gazette today: https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/middlesbrough-monitoring-more-south-american-21073267

 

The quotes:

"I don't want more than two," said Warnock, when asked how many South American players Boro could look to sign this summer.

"We are looking at another couple of Brazilians and Argentinians, but whether we get them or not (is not certain)."

"The recruitment guys gave it to us and then Leo looked into it," said Warnock.

"Steve, for all we haven’t got a lot of money, he always wants to gamble with the Argentinians and the Brazilians."

"He (Payero) is young, a good age, is going to the Olympics so it may not be a bad gamble."

 

From these quotes, it's clear that it is Steve Gibson's personal preference for us to sign some Argentinians or Brazilians, and that Warnock is at best open to accommodating them. Warnock's quotes are enlightening, yet concerning, as we now know that we have two separate recruitment strategies: one of Warnock focusing on value for money domestic signings, and the second of Gibson pushing signings from Argentina or Brazil that are going to cost a lot more. I say concerning, firstly, because history generally tells us that the more Steve Gibson gets involved, the more we mess up and waste money needlessly. The second reason for my concern is because I think we would operate far more effectively with one cohesive long-term strategy that has robust, objective recruitment processes that focused on all the continents like the successful benchmarks of Norwich and Brentford. Signing players just because "Steve Gibson has a bit of a thing for Argentinians and Brazilians" is not how any competitive football club should operate. His individual preferences are absolutely irrelevant, and should be treated as such.

He is a business man and therefore used to taking gambles. Sometimes they come of sometimes you lose. What I will say is those "Gibson" players look infinitely more exciting prospects than the "Warnock" linked players. That said we probably need a mixture of both.

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I love transfer thread cycles. Every time we are linked with someone good:

Day 1 Immense excitement

Day 2 If we want him then he will go to someone else

Day 3 How can we possibly afford him, we are meant to be broke

Day 4 Definitely a Gibson signing, Warnock won't want to play him

Day 5 We won't get a work permit

Day 6 Why haven't we signed him, Bausor is useless

Day 7 Signs for a much bigger club and everone agress he was useless all the time and would never have fitted in to our style of play

And repeat ...............

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2 hours ago, BelgianBoro said:

Just been reading on a Flamengo forum that there was a tipping issue in a restaurant called Simplesmente Vermelho with our future Brazilian star. 
The club have put a confidentiality clause in place so they can’t talk openly about it.

Apparently Muniz is too tight to mention.


 

boom tish! 
i thank you 

 

R-437893-1233943986.jpeg.jpg

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1 minute ago, Dynamo Kev said:

we signing this muniz like or is it just some spurious link?

Might be lazaro. Muniz would be a big coup with athletico madrid and inter Milan after him. Think they want about 10 million I saw

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51 minutes ago, Dynamo Kev said:

we signing this muniz like or is it just some spurious link?

It's a legitimate link, but there's a lot of untangling to do and there's a lot of fine print in any Muniz deal. I still believe it's more likely to be a deal for Lazaro from the same club rather than Muniz.

48 minutes ago, BoroJake said:

Might be lazaro. Muniz would be a big coup with athletico madrid and inter Milan after him. Think they want about 10 million I saw

So Muniz was going to Atletico for 5m, then Flamengo received a bid from a UAE based club for 7m, they went back to Atletico and asked them for 7m who promptly told them to get stuffed and withdrew their interest.

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17 hours ago, Blanco said:

You are making it out that Steve Gibson personally scouts the players and signs them. That’s not the case at all. By all accounts we now have a South American scouting network via Leo and his contacts over there. It would be absolutely negligent of Gibson not to look into using that network. Warnock appears quite happy to me to be able to avail of these players. By saying we are after one or two is him trying to dampen down the expectations a bit. I think it’s fantastic to have a dual approach to recruitment and not be stuck in the domestic market only. I’m pretty sure that there was a lot of complaining on here that we weren’t looking to the foreign market. Now that we are it seems to be a problem too. I feel for Steve Gibson, the poor man can’t win whatever he does 🙄

Steve Gibson can win: He can get the club to operate with a robust, long-term strategy. My reservations are regarding his two major flaws: he likes to take over control when he shouldn't, and makes decisions without any sort of long-term strategy.

He does have a track record of getting too involved in recruitment decisions (Alves, Woodgate, Downing, Rhodes etc) so it wouldn’t be a surprise if history has repeated itself. It’s notable that signing players from Argentina and Brazil goes against everything that Warnock has done in his previous promotions, and Warnock’s quotes clearly show that it’s not him driving the signings. Leo Percovich and his contacts in South America recommended us Carlos de Pena, our only signing directly from South American in his 5 years employed by us, so his recruitment influence over the years has been minimal and not very good to be honest, so that gives me no added confidence in the thoroughness of the decision-making.

Signing previously unknown young Argentinian or Brazilian players is obviously exciting, and I really hope that they prove to be excellent signings, but if we're signing them without an overall long-term strategy then I wouldn’t be surprised to see them turn out like the previous countless short-term exciting signings that ultimately turned out to be expensive failures. My key question is what is our plan for when Warnock likely retires at the end of the season? Will Gibson appoint a manager that plays a similar or a completely contrasting style of football? It's inescapable that the past 8 managerial appointments have been knee-jerking styles: Southgate, Strachan, Mowbray, Karanka, Monk, Pulis, Woodgate and Warnock. Another knee-jerk will have a major impact on all our current players and potentially render a Payero or Ikpeazu a square peg in a round hole and they'll obviously struggle. That's why a robust, long-term strategy needs to be in place.

If our scouting and recruitment team have picked out the players based on their ability and adaptability, and at the top of the club we have a robust, long-term strategy – that Gibson actually has the self-control to follow - to give them an excellent environment to perform and improve within then that’s excellent; It’s all I’ve ever wanted for more than the past decade. I'm sick of seeing a constant stream of square pegs in round holes through the various new styles of play that come with a new manager. However, if it is just some populist, short-sighted dalliance into Argentina and Brazil, without any thought about the bigger picture, then it is absolutely flawed strategically. You only have to take a cursory glance at to see Gibson’s shambolic short-sightedness in the Summer transfer window of 2017 in which we spent god knows how much on Assombalonga, Braithwaite, Fletcher and co, only to then sack the manager 4 months later and replace him with Pulis who played a completely different style of football. 

I appreciate that South American markets are more appealing for work permits after Brexit, but we've been absolutely awful at signings from abroad in the 4 years since relegation. I think there's only Braithwaite, Harrison (albeit he was born in England) and Stojanovic who we've signed from abroad - all of which we've handled absolutely terribly. So Gibson needs to learn the lessons of what went so wrong for us in them signings, and even the countless terrible domestic signings for that matter, so that the likes of Payero and any other Argentinians or Brazilians have a good chance of excelling in the environment here.

Hopefully it’s the start of a new, adventurous and successful approach to recruitment that blends into a robust, long-term strategy from the top of the club. 

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19 minutes ago, Brunners said:

Looks like Ravel Morrison has a trial at Derby. Landing on his feet again somehow.

Its crazy. His rescue will be the clubs under restrictions that can only sign players on a free. 

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  • Downsouth changed the title to Dan's Summer Transfer Thread. Aka: " Post Mortem Time""
  • Old Codger changed the title to Dan's Summer Transfer Thread. Aka: " Sporar Tomorar?""

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