Tom 2,492 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 9 minutes ago, RiversideRed said: Who's going to be the backup GK? - Orjan Nyland - Jamal Blackman - Luke Daniels - Frank Fielding - Kieran Westwood - Andy Lonergan All free's with Championship experience. Has to be a free or a loan. Some decent names in there, for a backup (I know we want someone to 'challenge for the gloves' but lets call a spade a spade). Having said that, Blackman is probably on a par with Lumley, he would be an interesting one to bring in. Now that he is finally no longer a Chelsea player, he probably wants to properly settle somewhere, ideally as first choice goalkeeper. Link to post Share on other sites
BoroJake 2,331 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 As much as I would love a Brazilian here, McNair is too valuable to sell. I think most managers would have him as a first choice midfielder even if Warnock doesn’t. He’s also very comfortable at the back. If we sold him we would need another midfielder and another defender to get quality like him in both positions would probably cost more than his selling price 4 Link to post Share on other sites
SzilardNemethsCurtains 2,844 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 19 minutes ago, SmogDane said: Good question, mate .. I read once, that the reason Man U let him go, was cause he didn't have the right mind for top competitive football. He has some technique He has stamina He can shoot and pass and is good at set piece deliveries He can defend He can do his trade mark flop But still ... I don't rate him that much .. as I wrote earlier, he is too nice. Still arguably our best player though 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Dynamo Kev 1,552 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 mcnair is *** in a back 4 and we are well stocked in midfield. he is probably a great player to sell for us as he wont be missed really. he probably made as many errors being caught out of position at cb resulting in goals conceded than anyone else. yet some love him. hes good on the bal and mediocre off it. Link to post Share on other sites
RiversideRed 1,216 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 In other news, Manchester United are prepared to let Phil Jones leave on a free transfer this summer. We've been linked with a loan move in the past for him under Warnock. Link to post Share on other sites
SmogDane 4,052 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, SzilardNemethsCurtains said: Still arguably our best player though It's in the eye of the beholder, mate. I think he is a first team player atm, but not the first on the sheet at all. Fry, Tav and Watmore ... Those I wouldn't sell for normal money. Link to post Share on other sites
Dynamo Kev 1,552 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 Just now, SmogDane said: It's in the eye of the beholder, mate. I think he is a first team player atm, but not the first on the sheet at all. Fry, Tav and Watmore ... Those I wouldn't sell for normal money. eye defense was like a civ without fry, thats how good paddy is lol. midfield is lost without tav and watmore is only forward who scores. all vital. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Redcar Rioja 5,872 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 40 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said: Problem is we'd be making up the squad numbers by selling a first-teamer. I'm not confident at all that we'd spend the money from one player on 3 players who don't just improve our first team but also cover the gap left by him. Unless the first-team is going to be better by selling him then there's no point, in my eyes. Just for arguments sake his going would likely fund Crooks who has just arrived and also Ciaron Brown and Kean Bryan on the payroll thereby more adequately covering the defence and midfield. I'm not saying lets get rid but I am being realistic in that the money to strengthen the squad has to come from somewhere and we can't be expecting all these new arrivals at zero cost. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 30 minutes ago, Redcar Rioja said: Just for arguments sake his going would likely fund Crooks who has just arrived and also Ciaron Brown and Kean Bryan on the payroll thereby more adequately covering the defence and midfield. I'm not saying lets get rid but I am being realistic in that the money to strengthen the squad has to come from somewhere and we can't be expecting all these new arrivals at zero cost. Well we've already signed Crooks so if we needed to sell to buy him that was a bit of a dumb thing to do. That's surely not a realistic assumption to make? As for Ciaron Brown or Kean Bryan, again, they're not improving the first 11 as far as I understand it so why bother selling someone who is pretty emphatically one of our best players (including having the prestigious oneBoro Player of the Season 2020/21 award to his name) to fund moves for them? I'd rather keep McNair than bring in 1 or 2 players who aren't expected to start anywhere near as many games as McNair does. Not to mention that Kean Bryan is out of contract so I don't really know why selling McNair is required to bring him in. I know all the money adds up but as it stands, we are making moves without seemingly intending on selling anyone barring maybe Akpom, Spence and Coulson. I don't get the feeling we're in a bad position in terms of needing to sell to buy so unless that changes, keep your best players. We are only making the first team worse by selling McNair. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
SzilardNemethsCurtains 2,844 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 57 minutes ago, Dynamo Kev said: eye defense was like a civ without fry, thats how good paddy is lol. midfield is lost without tav and watmore is only forward who scores. all vital. Won player of the year, only behind Tav and Fry on whoscored, played every game, most assists, I think he tailed off in the second half of the season mind but he was head and shoulders above the rest on the first half of the season. Fry was better overall for me but I wouldn't dream of selling McNair, as even if he's not out best player he is easily up there Link to post Share on other sites
chickenlunch 315 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 (edited) yes, let's sign some more players Link to post Share on other sites
Redcar Rioja 5,872 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 1 hour ago, wilsoncgp said: Well we've already signed Crooks so if we needed to sell to buy him that was a bit of a dumb thing to do. That's surely not a realistic assumption to make? As for Ciaron Brown or Kean Bryan, again, they're not improving the first 11 as far as I understand it so why bother selling someone who is pretty emphatically one of our best players (including having the prestigious oneBoro Player of the Season 2020/21 award to his name) to fund moves for them? I'd rather keep McNair than bring in 1 or 2 players who aren't expected to start anywhere near as many games as McNair does. Not to mention that Kean Bryan is out of contract so I don't really know why selling McNair is required to bring him in. I know all the money adds up but as it stands, we are making moves without seemingly intending on selling anyone barring maybe Akpom, Spence and Coulson. I don't get the feeling we're in a bad position in terms of needing to sell to buy so unless that changes, keep your best players. We are only making the first team worse by selling McNair. It's not a dumb thing to do if it's a Player that is wanted and delay would mean missing out (as we often have in the past), raising short term finance is commonplace in a business just as it is in people's private lives, so very far from "dumb". Buying something now knowing that you can recoup your costs by selling an asset in a few weeks is not unusual. Crooks could also arguably be the replacement for McNair in Midfield. We are currently short of a CB and struggling on the left side of defence and signing two left sided defenders would cover not only McNair as a CB but also Bola who seems to be a doubt and Coulson who seemingly isn't trusted as a defender. One out and three in is making the squad stronger for a hectic schedule ahead. Players out of contract may come "free" to the uninitiated but because they are "free" their agent will be negotiating a signing on fee and better wages in lieu of that fee. Selling Akpom, Spence and Coulson may be on the cards, certainly I suspect with the first two but if nobody wants them or is prepared to pay anything for them then what? Do we sign nobody and hope that the kids can make the step up? Are we hoping that SG has found a wedge of unexpected cash down the back of one of his Sofa's? The Global Pandemic has hit Governments let alone businesses hard, Bulkhaul and MFC are no exception, their profits will not have been immune to the decline and that's before we throw in the effects of Brexit in general and its impact on haulage in particular. Ideally we can keep him but considering Clubs outside of the Premiership were and still are in danger of going to the wall last season we can't spend something that we haven't got. It may not be McNair, it could be Tav or Fry but I suspect that we will need to raise as much as we can from somewhere especially with the South American links if they come off and that's before we take FFP into consideration. Link to post Share on other sites
TLF10 4,440 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 I assumed Crooks was signed with Saville money. Been reported in media and those ITK on here that we got £1.5m for Sav We spent £1.1m on Crooks. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 1 minute ago, Redcar Rioja said: It's not a dumb thing to do if it's a Player that is wanted and delay would mean missing out (as we often have in the past), raising short term finance is commonplace in a business just as it is in people's private lives, so very far from "dumb". Buying something now knowing that you can recoup your costs by selling an asset in a few weeks is not unusual. Crooks could also arguably be the replacement for McNair in Midfield. We are currently short of a CB and struggling on the left side of defence and signing two left sided defenders would cover not only McNair as a CB but also Bola who seems to be a doubt and Coulson who seemingly isn't trusted as a defender. One out and three in is making the squad stronger for a hectic schedule ahead. Players out of contract may come "free" to the uninitiated but because they are "free" their agent will be negotiating a signing on fee and better wages in lieu of that fee. Selling Akpom, Spence and Coulson may be on the cards, certainly I suspect with the first two but if nobody wants them or is prepared to pay anything for them then what? Do we sign nobody and hope that the kids can make the step up? Are we hoping that SG has found a wedge of unexpected cash down the back of one of his Sofa's? The Global Pandemic has hit Governments let alone businesses hard, Bulkhaul and MFC are no exception, their profits will not have been immune to the decline and that's before we throw in the effects of Brexit in general and its impact on haulage in particular. Ideally we can keep him but considering Clubs outside of the Premiership were and still are in danger of going to the wall last season we can't spend something that we haven't got. It may not be McNair, it could be Tav or Fry but I suspect that we will need to raise as much as we can from somewhere especially with the South American links if they come off and that's before we take FFP into consideration. No but you wouldn't spend money you didn't have if you didn't expect to get it, would you? Especially if it's going to put you in a troublesome position. I just don't see a direct correlation between us signing Crooks in particular over anybody else, including potential transfers. Add in the rest of the summer transfers as well because they all cost a sum of money to us in the short and long term that a sale would cover. What you're suggesting is not really based on anything. The club hasn't suggested we need to sell this summer where we don't actually want to so I don't know why anyone, in that atmosphere, would suggest we should sell a first-team player to fund any moves unless they undoubtedly make us better. If that were different then sure but I don't think we buy all the players we're hoping to right now under the pretence that we can sell McNair for a significant sum in a few weeks time. Has there even been any realistic interest in him this summer? If not then that's not a good start for justifying overspending then recouping costs later is it? All clubs have to work to a budget and I'm willing to bet Neil Warnock would rather keep Paddy McNair than have to sell him to spend somewhere else, especially if it comes to selling him just to improve squad depth. The first and most important thing for any team is to have a strong first 11, squad depth is secondary. The players you want to play 40+ games a season are your first priority. Who have we been linked with or signed this summer who is undoubtedly a significant improvement on what we had last year? I guess you could argue Ikpeazu in the fact he is much more of the kind of striker Warnock wants but beyond that, is there anyone we've signed who indisputably makes our first team better? Crooks might be better than Saville, Lumley might be better than Bettinelli, Peltier is cover (particularly for an injured full-back) and I wouldn't say Ameobi is any better than Watmore or Tav. People say a lot about these South Americans but there are very few people on here who actually know if they're any good. Brown and Bryan, I don't know a great deal about these either but are they expected to start games ahead of anybody else? Are they better than any of our current players? If that answer is not an immediate yes, why sell McNair to fund them being here? If we're struggling for money and we need to sell to fund moves, we'll definitely try to sell. But I don't see any indications that we need to, not when Gibson is finding money out of nowhere to fund moves for a couple of South Americans. Those in particular seem to be our intended big purchases this summer and I don't see how a business in this climate goes in to spend that sort of money if they need to sell to fund them and spend that money before they have any inclination that they'll make it back. Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 6 minutes ago, TLF10 said: I assumed Crooks was signed with Saville money. Been reported in media and those ITK on here that we got £1.5m for Sav We spent £1.1m on Crooks. That's kind of what I would have thought too. Whatever we made or basically didn't have to spend any more on Saville could have gone into the Crooks deal. We've also lost a big chunk off our wage bill this summer with Britt and Fletch going, I reckon Saville was on more than Crooks has come in on too. I just don't see any reason to think we're in sell-to-buy territory yet. Certainly not selling the best players we have to fund moves and surely we're not going in to spend a great deal of money right now without knowing for a fact that: a) We can afford to OR; b) We have something lined up to fund them I can't see anything really to suggest the latter so for now, I can only really see that we don't need to sell to improve the squad. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
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