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Boro V Watford 1-1 (Bolasie)


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27 minutes ago, AnglianRed said:

I can't argue with most of that.

But I think what @RiseAgainst was getting at is that we've been like this so many times this season against lesser teams we should have beaten.

Guess its an indication of the weird state football is in right now that we can play this way against a team of Watford's quality (on paper) and get a point, when in other games we've been well beaten.

I also wouldn't say we made Watford look ordinary...they weren't all that in the first game of the season and they've had a number of very average performances this season (including the previous game).

They may be PL quality...but we're probably talking lower-mid table. Which isn't that big a jump from the Championship.

With the greatest respect @AnglianRedin my opinion @RiseAgainsthad an issue with today’s performance. He didn’t mention any other game as far as I could see. He thinks Gibson and Warnock should retire from football if they are satisfied with today’s performance. There was nothing wrong with today in my opinion. I’m not having a go at either of you but there were a hell of a lot worse performances this season than today. I would point to the very lily livered attempt against Bournemouth on Friday as a perfect example 

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1 hour ago, Blanco said:

With the greatest respect @AnglianRedin my opinion @RiseAgainsthad an issue with today’s performance. He didn’t mention any other game as far as I could see. He thinks Gibson and Warnock should retire from football if they are satisfied with today’s performance. There was nothing wrong with today in my opinion. I’m not having a go at either of you but there were a hell of a lot worse performances this season than today. I would point to the very lily livered attempt against Bournemouth on Friday as a perfect example 

Agreed that Bournemouth was much worse. And we did make Watford look very ordinary but we've been doing that a lot of the season by turning it into a scrap. We're very good at that for the most part. But doing that will never get you promoted and if we aren't looking to get promoted then what the hell are we doing?

Against ANY team, regardless of who were playing, the least I expect is a genuine attempt to win the game. Today we didn't do that at any stage. One shot the entire game is pathetic. So although we did some other things well today, that's nowhere near the kind of all round performance that we need to be seeing. 

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3 hours ago, Blanco said:

With the greatest respect @AnglianRedin my opinion @RiseAgainsthad an issue with today’s performance. He didn’t mention any other game as far as I could see. He thinks Gibson and Warnock should retire from football if they are satisfied with today’s performance. There was nothing wrong with today in my opinion. I’m not having a go at either of you but there were a hell of a lot worse performances this season than today. I would point to the very lily livered attempt against Bournemouth on Friday as a perfect example 

Did you enjoy our performance today? How are we ever going to become a promotion-winning side when we go into every game with the attitude of stifling the opposition rather than believing that we can beat the opposition by playing our own game? We may grind out the odd upset playing that way but we are never ever going to gain promotion with that attitude. I thought we may have figured that out during the Pulis era.
 

The football is grim. Which I can (just abouts) accept if we are successful. But the football is grim and the results are mediocre (at best). And yet we give him another year in the job. I just don’t get it. I really don’t. This has to be the least bothered I’ve ever been about Boro. So fed up. 

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I am not happy with how we play atm. 

But .. 

We have had a lot of injuries to key players this season .. Plus a lot of situations going against us ..  We haven't played well for a lot of games .. and our tactics are often not good.  But still .. without those injuries to key players like Tav and Fry and without stupid penalties and not given red cards and stuff .. without that .. our not so good style may have been enough to squeeze in to the play offs .. Which is more than i hoped for after last years finishing 17th!

So Warnock has my backing at least 20 games into next season .. If we are not playing for promotion at that time .. It's time to go .. 

I'm not saying I enjoy his football .. But it's about results .. So i will give him untill we are 20 games in .. To prove his worth.  Earlier this season we played some marvelous football in spells .. If we can find some consistency and avoid injuries, we might be good after a hopefully good transfer window .. 

 

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2 minutes ago, SmogDane said:

I am not happy with how we play atm. 

But .. 

We have had a lot of injuries to key players this season .. Plus a lot of situations going against us ..  We haven't played well for a lot of games .. and our tactics are often not good.  But still .. without those injuries to key players like Tav and Fry and without stupid penalties and not given red cards and stuff .. without that .. our not so good style may have been enough to squeeze in to the play offs .. Which is more than i hoped for after last years finishing 17th!

So Warnock has my backing at least 20 games into next season .. If we are not playing for promotion at that time .. It's time to go .. 

I'm not saying I enjoy his football .. But it's about results .. So i will give him untill we are 20 games in .. To prove his worth.  Earlier this season we played some marvelous football in spells .. If we can find some consistency and avoid injuries, we might be good after a hopefully good transfer window .. 

 

This is exactly the problem though. Fans are so blinded by the shambles of Woodgate’s era that they are willing to put up with the mediocrity of what is currently happening. 
 

The thing that these fans are forgetting is that the squad that we had under Woodgate (and the squad that Warnock adopted) was never a relegation-quality side. It was a decent Championship side, that admittedly had a few holes, which was horrendously managed. 
 

I am convinced that had Warnock came in directly after Pulis and churned out the rubbish standard of football that he is currently churning out, the pressure on him to be sacked would be overwhelming. 
 

At the end of the day, the genius here is Steve Gibson. He has managed to lower expectations so much so that mediocrity is now hailed, whereas a year and a bit ago, it was enough for Pulis to be pushed out of the job. 

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48 minutes ago, J.T. said:

This is exactly the problem though. Fans are so blinded by the shambles of Woodgate’s era that they are willing to put up with the mediocrity of what is currently happening. 
 

The thing that these fans are forgetting is that the squad that we had under Woodgate (and the squad that Warnock adopted) was never a relegation-quality side. It was a decent Championship side, that admittedly had a few holes, which was horrendously managed. 
 

I am convinced that had Warnock came in directly after Pulis and churned out the rubbish standard of football that he is currently churning out, the pressure on him to be sacked would be overwhelming. 
 

At the end of the day, the genius here is Steve Gibson. He has managed to lower expectations so much so that mediocrity is now hailed, whereas a year and a bit ago, it was enough for Pulis to be pushed out of the job. 

Um I think Warnock challenge and expectation is promotion next season that isn't lowering expectation I think expectation has been built. The proff ia going to be in the summer window and how fast we start new season if we aren't in top 6 come Christmas time he'll be resigning or sacked. 

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3 minutes ago, DurhamRed said:

Um I think Warnock challenge and expectation is promotion next season that isn't lowering expectation I think expectation has been built. The proff ia going to be in the summer window and how fast we start new season if we aren't in top 6 come Christmas time he'll be resigning or sacked. 

That's a nice thought to go to sleep to, I'll be dreaming a warnockless 2022 tonight, thanks mate!

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Just now, Neverbefore said:

That's a nice thought to go to sleep to, I'll be dreaming a warnockless 2022 tonight, thanks mate!

Then we hire a rookie give them their first job we have complete chaos for a year get a veteran in I say big Sam this time to sort the mess out its the boro way 😁

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Just now, DurhamRed said:

Then we hire a rookie give them their first job we have complete chaos for a year get a veteran in I say big Sam this time to sort the mess out its the boro way 😁

And we're back to nightmares 

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9 hours ago, Kelloe said:

Is there any need to do it in such an arrogant and condescending way?

Its the only way he knows how. Don't take it personally - its just how he rolls. 😉

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11 hours ago, Blanco said:

With the greatest respect @AnglianRedin my opinion @RiseAgainsthad an issue with today’s performance. He didn’t mention any other game as far as I could see. He thinks Gibson and Warnock should retire from football if they are satisfied with today’s performance. There was nothing wrong with today in my opinion. I’m not having a go at either of you but there were a hell of a lot worse performances this season than today. I would point to the very lily livered attempt against Bournemouth on Friday as a perfect example 

I'll agree we have definitely turned in far worse performances this season.

My only real complaint, as mentioned previously, was the training / pre season feel to the game, in terms of effort and urgency. Though to be fair, Watford didn't make us work all that hard, except for brief spells.

Also, as NB4 said, the way we seem to negate better teams is to turn the game into a scrap, rather than trying to play good football. Resulting in niggly, stop-start games with no flow to them. Stops opposition teams building any momentum, but it also means we can't either.

Maybe thats the only way we can play for now, but its pretty boring and frustrating to watch and I sincerely hope Warnock is at least going to try to address this next season.

 

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11 hours ago, Blanco said:

With the greatest respect @AnglianRedin my opinion @RiseAgainsthad an issue with today’s performance. He didn’t mention any other game as far as I could see. He thinks Gibson and Warnock should retire from football if they are satisfied with today’s performance. There was nothing wrong with today in my opinion. I’m not having a go at either of you but there were a hell of a lot worse performances this season than today. I would point to the very lily livered attempt against Bournemouth on Friday as a perfect example 

You make a good point @Blancoabout previous games being worse - they were, and were deservedly called out at the time. But yes, I was specifically talking about yesterday's game. Look at the match stats and tell me they're not awful for a side supposedly chasing the play-offs. Re-watch the game and tell me who you feel gave a good account of themselves. Re-read pages 5-20 of this thread, and tell me how many people were satisfied with our play in real time.

Perhaps this season has ground me down, and I do accept we were playing a top two side, but we set out to 0-0 them into the ground just like we do every week. No desire. No hunger. No passion, for f***s sake. Did any of those players look like they cared for the Boro? To me, for the vast majority of the game, they looked like journeymen going through the motions. The entire club feels like it's going through the motions.

Again, this is all a matter of opinion, and perhaps you're seeing a half-full glass where I'm seeing it half-empty. No offence meant, but I completely disagree that there was nothing wrong with yesterday's (as it is now) performance. From my perspective, other than avoiding yet another defeat thanks to pretty much our only moment of quality in over 100 minutes, there was little right with it.

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@AnglianRedand @RiseAgainsti will reply to you both together. I think yesterday was a good performance and it garnered us a hard earned point. I say hard earned because it was. Watford are a top notch squad and we matched them all over the pitch. It was a blow losing Morsy in the first half and we conceded almost immediately after he went off. I was surprised to see Coulson replace him but even though he’s not my type of player to be fair to the lad he didn’t do too bad. One stat that stuck out to me during yesterday’s game tells me that we are actually doing very well. Watford have the best stat of fewest chances conceded (96) and we were joint third with 116. The fact that our supposed goalkeeper has the third worst stat for saves made sticks out like a sore thumb. If we had any sort of a goalkeeper we would be deeply embedded in the playoff places and maybe even be battling for the top two. 

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