Stoke v Boro 0-0

[Johnmfc81 634]

Also it's worth noting as soon as watmore gets the ball you just know he's going to run and hang onto the ball and try and score himself, instead of passing when that would be the better option. I've seen on a few occasions sporar being in a good position for a tap in if watmore had cut it back instead. 

[wilsoncgp 6,728]

20 hours ago, Neverbefore said:

Once is bad but can be forgiven, but there's a serious issue when you're missing two chances like that in just under 2 months. 

Imagine that was a play off final or something, we need someone with composure and can keep their head up top and watmore ain't it. Very useful in the last 25mins of any game for his energy and willingness to run, but he's not a top 6 striker in this league, not by a long shot.

Indeed.

I don't think we're entirely on the same page with Watmore but I do think those 2 misses are concerning. Perhaps harsh to tack this one on too but I do think when you see the other two, it makes you wonder if that problem is also evident with the Swansea chance he took far too long with.

Still think he's offering us a lot more than any other striker on our books would right now. I hesitate to include Sporar in that because I do think he looks a bit off the pace during attacks recently and I can't tell whether it's tactical in asking him to sit on the edge of the box sometimes. It's not always about busting a gut to get across the 6-yard box when you're playing the way we do, it's generally more about finding the space and hoping the pass comes but I have seen a couple of times where it felt like he needed to make a run he chooses not to.

[SmogDane 3,122]

Regarding Watmore ... Yes, he has missed two giant chances ... But how many attackers in this league would have scored the two beauties he scored in one game? 

Regarding Sporar ... Absolutely the best finisher we have ... We just need to serve him more than we do. We really need people who can pick the right passes ..  Give the ball to Sporar in position and he will score 8 of 10 chances ... Would like to see Payero feed him. 

Generally - Some of you think we should win each game and our attackers should score each game??? We are five games in, since Wilder got appointed and we have already improved a lot ... Things will get even better ... 

Look at Fulham, Bournemouth and WBA ... They have all had worse results than ours in the last five ... 

UTB 

[Borodane 3,799]

52 minutes ago, SmogDane said:

Generally - Some of you think we should win each game and our attackers should score each game???

You're the one saying Sporar will score 80% of his chances if given the ball 😉 I'm not expecting that, because if either Sporar or Watmore did that they wouldn't be playing in the Championship. 

[Johnmfc81 634]

4 minutes ago, Borodane said:

You're the one saying Sporar will score 80% of his chances if given the ball 😉 I'm not expecting that, because if either Sporar or Watmore did that they wouldn't be playing in the Championship. 

Exactly, some ppl are expecting us to sign perfect players when in reality we are just not going to do that in the championship. 

Watmore is a good striker, has a good work rate, runs himself into the ground each game. But he trys to do it all on his own sometimes when there's sometimes better options he could take. Sporar hasn't been quite as "greedy" for want of a better word. He tends to bring others into play alot more than watmore does. Perhaps he could do with being a bit more selfish. 

[TeaCider24 5,884]

I've not really seen any evidence of Sporar being a great finisher in a Boro shirt yet.

He scored one good goal against Forest 15 games ago, then managed a free header against Barnsley and a penalty.

He's snatched at plenty of chances since then, including against Stoke.

[Humpty 1,665]

Watmore and Sporar are absolutely fine as 2 of the 3 or 4 forwards we need at this level to win promotion. Unfortunately we need 1 or 2 others of equal or better quality to provide real competition for places and raise the level of quality amongst the forwards. Competition drives improvement and quality, at the minute there's little to no consequence of missing bad chances or playing poorly.

Having said that the fact we're talking about Watmore missing big chances is good on a couple of levels. Firstly we're creating those chances and secondly we have strikers getting into those positions to miss them. That's an improvement. 

Edited December 13, 2021 by Humpty

[sanddancer 1,461]

9 hours ago, Humpty said:

Watmore and Sporar are absolutely fine as 2 of the 3 or 4 forwards we need at this level to win promotion. Unfortunately we need 1 or 2 others of equal or better quality to provide real competition for places and raise the level of quality amongst the forwards. Competition drives improvement and quality, at the minute there's little to no consequence of missing bad chances or playing poorly.

Having said that the fact we're talking about Watmore missing big chances is good on a couple of levels. Firstly we're creating those chances and secondly we have strikers getting into those positions to miss them. That's an improvement. 

I applaud your spin on twisting what are depressing statistics for two strikers, position 52 & 56 in the championship scoresheet  list, and presenting them as favourable qualification to keep them. Even suggesting they could be instrumental in a promotion chase.  Are you a politician by any chance.  

Edited December 13, 2021 by sanddancer

[Denzel Zanzibar 4,182]

On 12/12/2021 at 8:14 PM, Borodane said:

We can definitely improve on Sporar and Watmore in January. Both are decent strikers but not the quality a promotion candidate needs. I’d be tempted to recall Cakpom and bring in one more while offloading Uche and Onel and sending Coburn on loan. I’d like to see just what Cakpom could do for Wilder. After all he is our asset and right now he’s just running down his contract. Unless of course the Greek team are willing to buy him. 

Probably won't help the lad if people keep calling him Cakpom

[Borodane 3,799]

1 minute ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Probably won't help the lad if people keep calling him Cakpom

It's his own SoMe nickname. He chose it himself😂

[Humpty 1,665]

11 hours ago, sanddancer said:

I applaud your spin on twisting what are depressing statistics for two strikers, position 52 & 56 in the championship scoresheet  list, and presenting them as favourable qualification to keep them. Even suggesting they could be instrumental in a promotion chase.  Are you a politician by any chance.  

I'm assuming the stats you're relying on are based on the majority of their time under the previous manager? Do you see where i'm going with this..

[sanddancer 1,461]

3 hours ago, Humpty said:

I'm assuming the stats you're relying on are based on the majority of their time under the previous manager? Do you see where i'm going with this..

Humpty I get where you are coming from, no offence. 
My posts support progress since Chris arrival but I still believe data over a prolonged period reveals a great deal, because it accounts for opposition, tactics, team and player form. The fact it covers every player in the championship playing for and against many teams which indicates both players mentioned are under performing. I don’t oppose that under Chris they can’t or won’t improve on these figures but question there quality, reliability. Let’s remember opportunities are relatively limited and chances must be taking when they are presented. Watmore in particular missed two sitters under no pressure. 
I do think it a tad to early to judge the team or individuals, and I think you would be pushed hard to find many critical of the progress we have witnessed. I also think we have our favourites and views on where and how we could be better, which makes the forum interesting reading.. 

[Humpty 1,665]

It's not favoritism. It's an opinion (granted) but it's an opinion on what i see when i've watched them both. I've seem quality from both, playing in a side that's been disjointed and lacking creative output. I don't write off a striker because he's missed two sitters, in the same way i didn't think Watmore was Messi when he scored that incredible goal last season. It's a balanced view and it takes into consideration the fact that these two have had scraps to work off most of the season. 

A top 6 side needs a stable of strikers and unfortunately we're not in a position to be loading up on expensive strikers. What i know, is that we're beginning to look more and more like a functioning unit that's defensively stable and creates more opportunities for the strikers. Josh Coburn's record is testament to that by the way.

I'm in no way saying on their own are they answer. We need another maybe two to really apply the pressure on them, which will only produce better performances from them and the new striker(s).

[Foxtrot Oscar Colin 529]

On 12/12/2021 at 11:02 AM, Downsouth said:

Certainly I am beginning to wonder just what he is offering to the team to be honest he is not that good!

Brought this up about 2 months ago saying he doesnt do enough seemed a very unpopular opinion back then.

I was of the opinion that he should be dropping a bit deeper at times and linking up and making his runs into the channel on the quick break aways instead of constantly doing it and going missing all game. I thought he did well in the first 2 wilder games where he clearly had been told to get more involved in the play he could have had goals and assists with a bit more luck but he's gone back to hiding a bit again the last three games and is being outshone by Watmore who offers alot more despite his occasional shocking miss.

I honestly think it comes down to attitude with him I don't think he wants it enough because he does have ability in short spells he looks really good and I can't understand why he can't be effecting games more often with his general play not just scoring goals.