Boro v Hull 0-1

[LBP 1,136]

GK

RWB cover (depends on Fisher) 

LWB

CB

CM

3 x ST 

Bamba and Howson 1 year extensions

Massive summer and I have faith we'll go up automatically next season 

[TeaCider24 6,042]

5 minutes ago, Skinemrippers said:

I personally can’t think of anything worse than getting hammered every week. The last time we were in the PL was depressing, not enjoyable at all. And it certainly didn’t leave us in a better position once we got relegated. Only just getting over that now. 

It certainly did leave us in a better position.

We were close to breaching FFP before we were promoted when Gibson pulled out all the stops for Karanka.

We then had 2 seasons of solid spending which we wouldn't otherwise have been able to manage.

Monk and Pulis messed those seasons up, and wasted the benefits, but the benefits were still very much there.

If we hadn't been promoted at all, we'd have possibly had a points deduction and been struggling in mid table with weaker finances than ever because of that one big push.

[Guffie 282]

Just want to say aswell. Do we do anything on the training ground with our set pieces. What was the routine today about? Short one to the front post. Baffling

[HolgateHero 99]

7 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said:

If we require a total rebuild upon Wilder leaving then Kieran Scott hasn't done his job properly when hiring the next man. After Karanka left, Orta was leaving too, there was no plan beyond Karanka, just that the man himself and his companions had to leave.

Being relegated with zero draws and zero wins and you don't think a total rebuild would be necessary. Ah, ok.

[wilsoncgp 6,791]

3 minutes ago, Guffie said:

Just want to say aswell. Do we do anything on the training ground with our set pieces. What was the routine today about? Short one to the front post. Baffling

I honestly thought that was just some rubbish set pieces, not an intentional thing. Matches up to most of our performance today, at least.

[wilsoncgp 6,791]

Just now, HolgateHero said:

Being relegated with zero draws and zero wins and you don't think a total rebuild would be necessary. Ah, ok.

Where did I say that?

If we get relegated with zero wins and zero draws, there's something rotten about the way we handled the entire season. All I said was if we get rid of Wilder and have to do a total rebuild, then Scott hasn't done his job. That's not if he only does so after 38 losses. Even we aren't stupid enough to allow that to happen, not a chance in hell does Wilder keep his job if he's looking like setting a record for literally the worst possible points tally you could get.

Part of his role is supposed to be building a squad based around a certain kind of philosophy, one that whoever he brings in to be the head coach needs to be able to work with and produce something similar. If he gets rid of one head coach, then he needs to bring in one to do a better job than the man before him with most of the same tools. Otherwise our Head of Football is not fulfilling his most significant role and also needs replacing.

[DurhamRed 1,490]

Bitterly disappointing result this one. We did start brightly and created a few chances but we don't seem composed in the final 3rd at all. Obviously people will blame lumley for the goal we conceded but we still should of been able to score against 19th in the league. Fry going off injured is troubling. But onwards and upwards onto a massive Easter hope Jones is back 

[smogsterking the Inspirati 1,320]

If promotion is at all possible this year we need to grab it with both hands. Theres no guarantee we will be as equipped to do it next season considering the likes of Tav, Fry, Jones etc. are going to be difficult to keep hold of. The only positive about staying down is the 3 teams looking like coming down don't strike me as the big clubs that have gone down recently so I don't think there would be a standout favourite.

If we were to be the whipping boys in the Premier league, there's no reason we can't do what Norwich have done and what Burnley did. You can't underestimate how much of an impact Premier league money can have. We should have bounced back up ourselves but mismanaged ourselves financially in the window. 

[White Band 713]

43 minutes ago, HolgateHero said:

I honestly can't believe we are thinking it would be a good idea to go up. We'd need a lot of new signings to hit the ground running and some old habits eliminating instantly or it would be a very tough slog. To go up and stay up you need to be more consistent and drilled in understanding and applying the managers ethos, and have backups with more in them than our (brilliant) veterans.

 

If we address keeper and striker issues then a lot of things will start coming together - we have defended very well and made tons and tons of chances a lot of the time - for now we are showing promise but are still a work in progress that I think would not stand the rigours of the PL. 

 

The mad thing is if we get in the playoffs then it's a mini cup and I think we'd be in with a solid chance. 

 

Haha, being a Boro fan

I don't think we're ready to go up. Yes, it would boost our income, but we would also have a huge increase in outgoings especially if we want to attract premier league standard players. The club has finally come together again under Wilder and the more positive vibe has been refreshing.  The grind of premier league defeats with an occasional draw thrown in would destroy that. Fans would get disillusioned. We would not stay in the premier league because we are not ready for it, and then the whole cycle of the past few seasons would start again.  I honestly don't find that idea appealing. 

That said, I think it would be extremely difficult to get promoted next season. Norwich and Watford always go straight back up (or so it seems!). If Everton come down I think Rooney will go there and get them promoted. If Burnley come down they will either go straight back up or implode.

[HolgateHero 99]

12 minutes ago, smogsterking the Inspirati said:

If promotion is at all possible this year we need to grab it with both hands. Theres no guarantee we will be as equipped to do it next season considering the likes of Tav, Fry, Jones etc. are going to be difficult to keep hold of. The only positive about staying down is the 3 teams looking like coming down don't strike me as the big clubs that have gone down recently so I don't think there would be a standout favourite.

If we were to be the whipping boys in the Premier league, there's no reason we can't do what Norwich have done and what Burnley did. You can't underestimate how much of an impact Premier league money can have. We should have bounced back up ourselves but mismanaged ourselves financially in the window. 

I disagree, didn't Burnley and Norwich go up as champions? so their teams had more than just the bones of a squad  with the potential of reaching the playoffs, they were already well-oiled machines.

We don't have that at the moment so I don't think you could extrapolate what league champions achieved to equate to what we - stuttering playoff hopefuls - are capable of at this time.

 

 

[boro-unger 2,495]

44 minutes ago, Guffie said:

Just want to say aswell. Do we do anything on the training ground with our set pieces. What was the routine today about? Short one to the front post. Baffling

You can tell from Howson's super secret pre-corner ball bounces what the routine is going to be... 

1 bounce = hit the first man

2 bounces = straight to the keeper

3 bounces = out the far side for a goal kick

[sanddancer 1,461]

1 hour ago, Changing Times said:

Disappointing today, and another mark against Wilder in my book unfortunately.  Midweek was as well although I think he perhaps got more of a pass because of the opposition, and because we came close to not losing.  I'm not a fan of managers who are pretty much inflexible in their thinking.  Even the likes of Klopp, and Guardiola, who essentially have the best squads in world football, sometimes change their approach a bit.  When you don't have the best players in the world then it's more incumbent on managers/head coaches to get the best out of whatever they do have.  There's no way on earth that this means constantly playing the exact same shape, same tactics, no matter the situation, or the opposition.  Wilder seems intent on doing that though.

Today we were once again without Jones.  Forgetting what he brings in terms of his individual talent for a moment, what this essentially means is that we don't have an attacking right hand side.  Theoretically you could play McNair there perhaps, or Dijksteel possibly, but neither give you what Jones gives you, and neither concern the opposition like Jones does.  Moving your best midfielder to the right hand side so that you can keep the same shape is just dumb however.  Probably as dumb as refusing to recall a player who seems to be wanted by half the top clubs in Europe because 'we don't need him' or 'he wouldn't be playing'.  We do need him, he would be playing, just as long as we had a manager with a little flexibility, which unfortunately comes back to a cross against Wilder.

At this point someone, perhaps even Wilder, might say that we looked better in midweek when Tavernier went to right wing back.  Actually, no, we looked better when we replaced two fairly slow fullbacks with two players who could run and have a bit of pace, and looking better when you haven't really done much as an attacking side really isn't that difficult.  In midweek I think Wilder, realising Jones was out, played a weakened side in my opinion.  The two striker changes were part of it.  That we nearly got something after he replaced some of his changes isn't a tick for Wilder.  We wasted the best part of an hour doing nothing. 

The game today to me was crying out for four at the back from the start.  Why play wingbacks when you only have one available?  Bola, McNair, Fry, Dijksteel as a back four would have been fine.  That then allows you to keep Tavernier as a midfielder, and play another midfielder or attacking player against a team who were likely to sit back.  In fact, just playing four at the back would have allowed us to drop Crooks if we wanted to (I know some people do).  It would have given us options, and we didn't really have them with the way we set up.  Not to mention that every team out there knows in advance what we're going to do.  All of this is on Wilder.  He, or people on here, can complain about the squad if they want to, but we have enough players to play something other than 3-5-2 week after week.

We can definitely say that Lumley has again made a mistake, this one costing us a goal.  But without conceding that goal we were still only on for a goalless draw, which would be a poor result in itself.  We're a better team than we were under Warnock, which I am grateful for.  We play better football for the most part, which I am grateful for.  But Wilder is beginning to look like a one trick pony, and I would really like to see more from him, not the players.  Harsh possibly but that's where I'm at currently.

I like the honesty.
One thing that stands out about CW is his repetition for the same tactics and reluctance to change. Looking at the stats I think the lift we got on his arrival started to dissipate across 2022. That and quality, squad size and teams have worked us out. To be fair he is limited because of the squad and quality but I’m now reading more about his spell at Sheffield and asking if history is or will repeat itself. I don’t get his faith in Lumley and I don’t think his signing have worked out either. For the short term at least I still think he is the right person because he has lifted the club.

[Guffie 282]

Also can’t get over the referee blowing for half time as we are just about to cross the ball. Wouldn’t of scored it tbf 🤣

[TeaCider24 6,042]

6 minutes ago, sanddancer said:

I like the honesty.
One thing that stands out about CW is his repetition for the same tactics and reluctance to change. Looking at the stats I think the lift we got on his arrival started to dissipate across 2022. That and quality, squad size and teams have worked us out. To be fair he is limited because of the squad and quality but I’m now reading more about his spell at Sheffield and asking if history is or will repeat itself. I don’t get his faith in Lumley and I don’t think his signing have worked out either. For the short term at least I still think he is the right person because he has lifted the club.

That'll be the 100 point League One promotion season, a narrowly missed out play-off push, then automatic promotion and then a 9th place Premier League finish?

He's been here for exactly half a season.

Even after two defeats in a row, he's got the 6th best record in the league in the time he's been here.

[sanddancer 1,461]

1 minute ago, TeaCider24 said:

That'll be the 100 point League One promotion season, a narrowly missed out play-off push, then automatic promotion and then a 9th place Premier League finish?

He's been here for exactly half a season.

Exactly. I think in the short term he is the right man to rebuild the club.