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Is it just me or do people seen to be less willing to give wilder his chance next season after a half year finishing 7th than they were to give Warnock another season last summer after finishing 10th

Bit of length one here lads, but i needed to post it for my own sanity. I keep reading comments of people talking about how luton and sheffield are playing sides "with nothing to play for" and It

Are you watching the same stream as me? 

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2 hours ago, Duvel said:

Good point, I don't think there's been an attitude problem at all. Warnock described them as a good set of lads when he normally would be more likely to throw them under the bus after his sacking. 

I don't think there's been an attitude problem at all, the poor run of form has been the result of us lacking quality and a bit of tactical nous to break teams down. 

Talking about attitude now feels like a deflection exercise. 

My understanding when he talks about attitude isn't about lack of effort or players being bad eggs in the dressing room.

I think he means attitude in terms of leaders. People who stand up and be counted when things aren't going our way - whether that's leading by example through bravery on the ball, or verbally organising teammates. 

He's said they're a lovely group of lads - but quiet. Our biggest characters aren't really in the side- Bamba, Taylor, Peltier. 

I think there's something in that. Too many players shrink and hide when things start going wrong. And I don't just mean pointing and bellowing - but knowing when to take the sting out a game and get a bit of control back. Maddo talks about it a lot too. 

Thinking back to our promotion side... Leadbitter, Friend, Gibson, Ayala, Clayts, Dimi, Nugent etc... Not the most talented players ever, but all had that winning mentality and hunger for clean sheets. Guys you'd want by your side when shi* hits the fan. 

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14 minutes ago, BoroSmoggie said:

Think Bola will be sold.

Me too. His injury prone and hasn't progressed. Doesn't offer enough for LWB. I feel as though he'd be fine as backup.

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This "attitude/ability" thing sounds almost like Pulis and his Aard Men.

I suspect that the surprises may be Jones, Bola, McNair, Fry and Tav. I hope that there isn't a twist in his surprise and he brings Connolly back for his attitude! There are others that wouldn't be missed, in fact the reality is that there were a quite a few who weren't missed at all during their absence.

Wilder had the fans eating out of his hand and walking on water in the eyes of many not long ago. I can't speak for others but the Burnley affair rubbed me up the wrong way as well as the journalists who prodded him. He talks about Leadership, well he should realise that in his capacity as the Manager of MFC he is one of the most influential Leaders at the Club. What he does and says carries weight and sets the tone.

If Connolly as an example had said something stupid or handled something badly not many would be surprised, even Woodgate wasn't the sharpest knife in the drawer but Wilder conducted himself really poorly and in a manner falling far short of true Leadership. We needed a clear and unequivocal "This Manager is not for turning", not too much to expect from a Leader in any walk of life. Our end of season run-in seemed to be spluttering for whatever reason and the timing of his ill advised response may just be coincidental but I have an uncomfortable feeling because of it. I guess the word is trust and like a few previous Managers I now have trust issues with him.

His football was initially far better to watch than Warnock's and the improvement in results were welcome but his seeming lack of acceptance that maybe Plan A isn't the be all and end all in all situations raises a huge question mark. His "denial" at least to himself that perhaps he had dropped one with Connolly and Balogun coincided with us starting to look desperate in too many games, resorting to hoofing it to two diminutive Strikers. Ironically one of his preferred pairing had attitude but limited ability whilst the other had ability but it appears for the last few games at least perhaps lacking attitude?

The long term plan for the Club and the style of football we play, the scouting and recruitment and Wilder himself has left me with far more question than I had back in January. I'm OK if he stays but equally I'm OK if he goes, actions speaks louder than words but for me his words lately have been poorly chosen and I'm less than convinced by some actions out on the pitch which ultimately is where it really matters.

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Wilder has made this comment

“I think Jonny Howson was one player I can rely on from a mentality point of view and today he looked at home and comfortable in the game. He was a leader today and by far our best performer.”

I think it’s official that I don’t watch the same thing as Wilder.

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Let me be the first to state the obvious…….

 

This time next year, Boro are ……..

 

Going up as Champions 🏆

 

😀😀😀

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In fairness to Wilder I'd agree that Howson was our best Player today but I am concerned at how poor and dysfunctional the other ten Players around him were. That takes some doing especially in a game with such high stakes and unbelievable support.

Today wasn't just one of those bad days at the Office. Preston are a decent side and losing to them there isn't a surprise for Boro but the manner of it was down to far more than just mentality, attitude or ability. As it happens the result was totally irrelevant thanks to Fulham going AWOL and Reading's Keeper having an aberration.

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Just woken up to see this and I'm glad all the speculation can end. 

We were in no way good enough to make the playoffs and that for me is a blessing. A lot wanted us to go up to see what would happen, but some of the gubbings we have taken this season would be all the worse in the PL.

A striker is the holy grail for us, we've made so many chances in games and had 10 or 20 shots with no goals. Someone to just pop the ball in the net will bring a lot as well as goals, it gives everyone belief and confidence. 

Big plus this season has been Matt Crooks, without him we'd have been struggling big time. His goals and his play with Jones, and his assists have been absolutely massive for us. Our top scorer and highest scoring midfielder since Leadbitter - who took penalties.

But I don't think Crooks would cut it in the PL, could see him getting even more yellows and perhaps being a bit slow.

It was too much to ask Jones to do all our attacking, I think the fact we didn't recall Spence was huge call. If we were serious about the playoffs we'd have been wanting to weaken our opponents and bring him back even if he didn't play for us. Having back up for Jones, or just playing them as opposing wing backs could have been interesting. Our decision here spoke volumes to me.

Some supremely clever wheeling and dealing is needed to get our squad capable of a sustained push, and then not need a total overhaul when it ends up in the PL. We have been lead to believe we have the staff to do that so now it's over to them.

If wilder persists with this same idea of style of striker though then we'll struggle big-time. It's fair to say giving experience to Connelly and balagoun had ZERO benefit for us, with Coburn and watmore looking more effective.

Oh, and a keeper. Randolf hasn't played much at West ham, perhaps he wants some footy before he retires. 

Wilder has it all to do, how we can capitulate on the last day so badly when needing a win at the least shows how much work needs to be done and how unready we were for the POs and promotion. 

Summer transfer thread will be the place to be for a couple of months, let's hope we hit the ground running.

UTB

 

 

 

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Only player I can envisage going that might be a surprise is McNair. Always a chance that money comes in for Fry, Jones or Tav, so they wouldn’t necessarily be surprises.

I think Lumley and Daniels will be gone. Bola may well be made available. Siliki gone. Connolly, Sporar and Balogun sent back. Peltier, Taylor and Bamba released. None of that would be a surprise either.

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Problem today and it's happened in other games, is when Howson pushes forward and joins in the attack, which is good, the midfield is left wide open, nobody drops in to cover , Mcgree was way out of position so was Crook , this must be sorted out , also the gap between defence and midfield was too big ,

This is were smart experienced players understand when this happens, we need at least four of five , trouble is Scott wants young sell them on talent, Wilder wants to build a winning team.

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15 minutes ago, HolgateHero said:

Just woken up to see this and I'm glad all the speculation can end. 

We were in no way good enough to make the playoffs and that for me is a blessing. A lot wanted us to go up to see what would happen, but some of the gubbings we have taken this season would be all the worse in the PL.

 

Strange take for me that. Would much rather take a few gubbings in the Premier League with an extra £100 million in our back pocket than “building” for another season in this league.

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12 minutes ago, Humpty said:

Only player I can envisage going that might be a surprise is McNair. Always a chance that money comes in for Fry, Jones or Tav, so they wouldn’t necessarily be surprises.

I think Lumley and Daniels will be gone. Bola may well be made available. Siliki gone. Connolly, Sporar and Balogun sent back. Peltier, Taylor and Bamba released. None of that would be a surprise either.

I'd be gutted if we sold Tav. Think he's the only one we couldn't replace with the same quality. 

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To be honest, I’d be gutted if we sold Fry, Tav or Jones. I’m yet to place my trust fully in Kieron Scott, so I don’t have faith in him replacing them. Not to say Scott doesn’t have it in him, I’ve just not seen the evidence yet.

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19 minutes ago, Humpty said:

Strange take for me that. Would much rather take a few gubbings in the Premier League with an extra £100 million in our back pocket than “building” for another season in this league.

You and I  have a different idea of what success looks like, how to get there and how spirit and momentum are more important than 100M in the champo to rebuild a relegated PL team.

If we went up we'd need a massive overhaul. Do you buy players for the PL or ones with an eye on winning promotion again? Some players you will have only attracted because of the PL, they'll want out, the fan base will have dwindled and become disengaged, the atmosphere poisonous, the manager ditched, another rebuild necessary. And you'd like that?

Never ever does money equal success, it is by no means at all a given. I'd rather a team already pulling together than the potential to sign more players after relegation (and be able to maintain the wages of the new players on PL salaries). 

Academic now, what you would prefer is no longer of significance so we can put the whole speculation of what would be better for us to bed now.

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13 minutes ago, Humpty said:

To be honest, I’d be gutted if we sold Fry, Tav or Jones. I’m yet to place my trust fully in Kieron Scott, so I don’t have faith in him replacing them. Not to say Scott doesn’t have it in him, I’ve just not seen the evidence yet.

Same. Fair bit of hype from some boro fans that Scott is going to get us some foreign gems etc etc. Nothing has told me he’s really capable of that YET. Not saying he’s going to be useless, but i’m definitely in the ‘hopeful’ camp rather then ‘expecting’ camp. 

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