QPR v Boro 3-2 (Crooks, Forss)

[AnglianRed 6,320]

5 minutes ago, Leesider said:

The weaknesses in the squad were obvious to everyone,There seems to he no joined up thinking re transfers at the club.Wider has said repeatedly he is heavily involved in recruitment but yet has no clue whats going on!

Everything seems to move in slow motion. I thought the whole idea of Scott & Co were identifying players early.That has'nt happened.

You could be right about other teams forums but i could'nt be arsed looking.Its hard enough reading this one at times🤣

I got a serious vibe from that interview that got posted yesterday that Wilder isn't entirely happy with the situation. When he said he is involved in the transfer process, but that he's only one of a few people that have a say, I got the feeling there was some thinly-veiled exasperation there.

Its possible that there are some arguments going on about who we should be recruiting, which could be slowing things down...in addition to actually finding suitable targets who want to come here for the money we're prepared to pay.

So yeah, the idea probably was for Scott and his team to do some advance scouting and identifying potential candidates, but now we've got Wilder having his 2 pennies' worth and now they're having to find other players that he will approve of.

Like you I was looking forward to a faster, slicker transfer window and for us to have a significantly improved squad in time for the start of the season, so we could hit the ground running, for once. But it seems yet again we will be playing catch-up and maybe even waiting until January for some players.

Too early to panic yet, but its definitely a disappointing start.

 

[Bruce 1,565]

29 minutes ago, Smokedsalmon said:

Coming back from the match yesterday, I think it showed us all what we already knew; we are still 5-6 players away from being a top team and that we are incredibly inconsistent.

For me though, perhaps controversially, I really don't think we are well suited to this 3-5-2 system at all.

The back 3 should be the strongest part of the team on paper but I don't think it suits Fry or McNair. McNair is a midfielder for me, and Fry is not mobile enough to play as a wide centre back. I haven't seen enough of Lenihan to judge yet but I get the feeling he would feel more comfortable in a 2 as well. Bola should be nowhere near the team as a centre-half and I think Dijksteel is probably the only one who suits the wide centre-back role.

I think Jones and Giles are very average defenders, but good wingers. Giles in particular would be unbelievable at left wing. Jones needs to pull his finger out, for me. He was awful yesterday, both in possession and out of it. I don't think either are at their best as wing backs. Defensive responsibility tires them out and means after 60 minutes they're both pretty shot.

I think the midfield three are not suited to 3-5-2 at all;

Howson is not mobile enough to be the lone holding midfielder. McGree is clearly a #10, he's the best player we have at progressing the ball and driving, but he's trying to do it so deep that he gets crowded out and loses the ball a lot because of it. Crooks, again, plays his best football going forwards, with good goal/assist records, but he struggles to play box to box and impact the game in the midfield.

We are missing a deep-lying playmaker (like Josh Cullen at Burnley) and we are missing a midfield enforcer (in the mould that Clayton used to be for us). Both are integral in a system like this because the game is won and lost on being able to use your midfield numbers to control that part of the pitch. In the first half our midfield was not impacting on the game whatsoever.

Our strikers are probably the only part of the team genuinely suited to 3-5-2 as I don't think any of them could operate on their own. Hopefully that will soon change with reinforcements.

Long ramble there but I just couldn't help but feel if we had set up something like this...

Or even..

.

It gets our best players in their best position and shares defensively responsibility more evenly throughout the team. 3-5-2 relies so heavily on the back 3 & the midfield 3 to be defensively spot on and generally I believe it only suits elite teams like Chelsea who's defenders aren't going to make the same amount of errors as ours do.

I know Wilder had success with 3-5-2 with Sheffield United, but he had players who were more suited to playing that system and he built it over 3-4 years. He has come straight in here and tried to apply the exact same philosophy to a squad of players who, for me, just don't have the same qualities as the ones he had before.

My understanding is, and having looked back at Transfermarkt, that Wilder used to play 4 at the back then, he lost his first four matches in charge of Sheffield Utd and changed to his current system. I think he found the right system for the players he had. Now he's trying to find the right players for the system.

Personally, I think his current system has been found out. It's not that 3-5-2 is inherently bad but the way he sets up and the players he has means it can't cope with pressure. It's great at applying pressure when we're on top and generates lots of chances but unless he can come up with a way of handling being pressed we are going to lose to any team that can apply a half-decent press.

[AnglianRed 6,320]

49 minutes ago, Dynamo Kev said:

it was bad but everytime i see that second goal its just a clean a foul on the keeper as you can get. he bumps him from behind as he goes to catch the ball and it pushes him under it and he misses the catch. if we had VAR they would have 2 goals we would have 3. because our offside goal was fine to. the offside player never touched it at all. 

we won  the game even after being so bad. if officials decisions were correct.

 

This is the Championship, remember? 

We need to be able to win despite crappy refereeing. 😉

[Denzel Zanzibar 6,972]

1 hour ago, Dynamo Kev said:

it was bad but everytime i see that second goal its just a clean a foul on the keeper as you can get. he bumps him from behind as he goes to catch the ball and it pushes him under it and he misses the catch. if we had VAR they would have 2 goals we would have 3. because our offside goal was fine to. the offside player never touched it at all. 

we won  the game even after being so bad. if officials decisions were correct.

 

Aye, definitely a foul on Steffen, normally goalkeepers are a lot more protected than that. Refereeing in the Championship is *** awful though, shouldn't be surprised it wasn't given.

Not sure on our offside decision, Crooks was still interfering with play wasn't he? Did the laws of the game change regarding that?

I think a draw would have been an incredibly generous result, we didn't deserve anything from the game in my opinion.

 

[GrimsbyBoro 1,968]

Not going to get carried away as it’s early doors but there’s a few concerns. My main one is we don’t look any different to last season. Simple balls get in behind the defence, we vacate dangerous spaces and the “DM” doesn’t do the “D” bit.

Not going to be critical of Howson as he must be doing what Wilder wants him to do.

I had hoped some of these issues would have been sorted in preseason but it looks like it a part of Wilder ball. 

[Erimus74 3,072]

Just seen the goals, my they were weak, no excuse, very poor defending to give us a mountain to climb, the thumpings we suffered last season came back to haunt us 

Will QPR be among the cchasing pack, if not & they cut us up so easy we have things to worry about

One plus, Marcus Forss off the mark, hopefully the 1st of many when he scored the 134th full debut goal 

[wilsoncgp 9,283]

2 hours ago, TeaCider24 said:

I do find it funny how many daft fans are still trying to claim it's because of the Burnley situation when we do badly.

Wilder and the team can cock up without it being a conspiracy.

Yeah, I'm not convinced that Wilder is sat wondering how much better he could have had it at Burnley right now.

I'm still annoyed by that situation and time will tell how committed he is to this club when a situation like that presents itself again. But right now, I don't think him or his staff are thinking about anything but Middlesbrough.

If anything is distracting him right now, perhaps the lack of transfer movement is the issue because he will be involved in that process and that will be taking some of his focus away from the players.

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

Always irritated after a defeat of course but yesterday’s performance really, really annoyed me. I left Loftus Road frustrated with boro in a way I haven’t felt for a long time. 
 

I’ve given it some thought as to why that was and it reminded me of when we lost to Bristol 1-0 at home in our promotion season. I remember coming away from that thinking all of those issues from last season were still there, laid bare for all to see. 
 

I don’t think there’s a direct parallel from that game to yesterday but there’s certainly some similarities. Given our clearly incomplete transfer activity, it hardly took a professional analyst to guess that a lot of last season’s issues would still be apparent now but it’s frustrating to still see these glaring problems from last season carry over to this one.

Certainly not a time to panic but the first half yesterday was worrying - no two ways about it. I have a lot of faith in Wilder and I’m willing to believe in the new direction we’re trying to go in as a club but I’m equally concerned that these issues won’t be properly addressed. 
 

In 15/16 we got there in the end, just have to hope this season is the same.  

[sanddancer 1,967]

I believe Chris has publicly issued the club a warning, he is not happy with transfers.

I question the lack of energy and stamina throughout the squad. How on earth had we signed players who can’t manage 90 mins in a game, or cover a average, I believe is, 6.5 miles. I don’t believe any of the players or manager deserve a score over 4 yesterday. 

Rebuilding is a byword commonly used at the club that’s past it’s sell by date. It’s time the club revealed the plan and started to produce the goods and results. 
 

[Erimus 63 481]

51 minutes ago, sanddancer said:

I believe Chris has publicly issued the club a warning, he is not happy with transfers.

I question the lack of energy and stamina throughout the squad. How on earth had we signed players who can’t manage 90 mins in a game, or cover a average, I believe is, 6.5 miles. I don’t believe any of the players or manager deserve a score over 4 yesterday. 

Rebuilding is a byword commonly used at the club that’s past it’s sell by date. It’s time the club revealed the plan and started to produce the goods and results. 
 

The club is Gibson. Might as well call it Gibson FC.

[Humpty 3,261]

5 hours ago, Leesider said:

A lot of this forum were happy to sell McNair.A lot of this forum were adamant that there was no rush in getting our squad completed until the end of the window. 5 points dropped in 2 games would indicate a lot of the forum members were completely wrong.

I think you missed the point. It was (and still is) better to wait and get the right players than rush and get the wrong players. There was always the possibility of dropping points whilst this process progressed up until the end of august. Pressure is on the recruitment team to ensure we do get the right players now.  

[OldManGravz 1,350]

6 hours ago, Leesider said:

A lot of this forum were happy to sell McNair.A lot of this forum were adamant that there was no rush in getting our squad completed until the end of the window. 5 points dropped in 2 games would indicate a lot of the forum members were completely wrong.

Better to drop a few points now, get the right players in and then start rising the table instead of rushing to get players in sooner who perhaps aren't as good and lead to us dropping more points over the season.

Said it before and will say it again, you see loads of teams in the championship coming from nowhere mid season and getting promotion. Where we are at the end of August doesn't matter as much as who we bring in.

I've also not seen anyone talking about selling McNair

[sanddancer 1,967]

1 hour ago, Erimus 63 said:

The club is Gibson. Might as well call it Gibson FC.

By the lack of communication it does seem he has lost interest. 

[Leesider 1,076]

1 hour ago, OldManGravz said:

Better to drop a few points now, get the right players in and then start rising the table instead of rushing to get players in sooner who perhaps aren't as good and lead to us dropping more points over the season.

Said it before and will say it again, you see loads of teams in the championship coming from nowhere mid season and getting promotion. Where we are at the end of August doesn't matter as much as who we bring in.

I've also not seen anyone talking about selling McNair

I really dont understand that arguement at all. Surely its better to get players in early,get a proper preseason & get off to a flying start.

As far as i know the 3 points for a win is the same in August or April.

How often do we hear managers talking about not having enough time on the training ground because of the hectic schedule.Preseason is vital,Gelling the group is vital,Team bonding is vital.A good start is better than a poor one.We have had a very poor one largely because the recruitment has been so slow.

As regards Mc Nair,theres been loads of posters suggesting he should be sold.

 

[Leesider 1,076]

1 hour ago, Humpty said:

I think you missed the point. It was (and still is) better to wait and get the right players than rush and get the wrong players. There was always the possibility of dropping points whilst this process progressed up until the end of august. Pressure is on the recruitment team to ensure we do get the right players now.  

I didnt miss the point at all.I just dont agree with you.No point in going through it all again.

You are right about the pressure being on now for recruitment.