1 minute ago, diggerlad07 said:

Anyone who thinks Gibson is going to spend in January is deluded.....

We have the best manager in the league imo and Gibson didn't back him in the summer , even though we had various opportunities so he's not going to do it now when transfer prices are inflated in the window.

Today is highly frustrating but what do you expect when you sign league 1 players like Greenwood , Silvera, Gilbert and have Crooks and Coburn in attack.

Said it from start of season, without Carrick at the helm this squad would be towards the bottom 6 and 3points from play offs .

It’s hard to say though isn’t it? We clearly had a striker lined up to come in summer which didn’t happen (I don’t think it was cannon), who’s to say that deal isn’t back on now? I mean it could have been Vasquez who’s now open for a move now the season has ended. 
 

We don’t even need much spending, certainly not this January. Our defenders are fine, midfield is pretty good imo, all we need are 1 or 2 forwards who are a bit more established/developed than what we have. 
 

I really don’t understand this general cloud of doom and gloom that seems to be hanging over the club in the fans eyes. Things really aren’t that bad. We have a great keeper, a pool of good CBs, 2 LBs that are starting to look good, 4 CMs who have all shown they are capable of competing at the top. It’s just the front 4 where we have to many hot and cold options. 

1 minute ago, DurhamRed said:

I expect a big janaury and 3 or 4 key signings. Scott was on radio tees a few weeks back saying we are ready to bring players in 

I really really hope you are right but I expect it to be more signings like Gordon from Liverpool under 23s.  We need proven quality and those signings don't come cheap

 

10 minutes ago, AnglianRed said:

That was also back in the 1980s when you could get away with that kind of thing. Maybe officials in Scotland were a lot more thick-skinned back then and gave as good as they got?

As for The Special One - god only knows. Portuguese and Spaniards have that hot Latin temperament. But he still got in trouble when he tried it over here. Particularly when he was at Chelsea and had a go at the club doctor for treating an injured player at an inconvenient point in a match.

I'm just pointing out Carrick is in a very different situation. Not saying he shouldn't lodge formal complaints against crap officials, but it wouldn't do any good for him to start ranting at them from the touchline.

1980's Scotland is irrelevant, he done it all thorugh his United tenure as well. I'm not advocating him going on a foul mouthed rant and headbutting the fourth official but a Warnock style moan at the Officials (as Farke did today) as they are leaving the pitch and some snide cynical comment about hoping the Officials are up to the speed of the game and aren't afraid to make big calls during Press Conferences would help.

Even after game interviews saying that he is lost and clearly doesn't understand the rules of the game especially when it comes to Penalties. Just enough to ruffle feathers but not enough to warrant sanctions if he is too timid or if he wants to, go full on just once and let the TV studios examine his claims which in turn puts pressure on forthcoming Officials. How many Penalties were Away sides awarded at Old Trafford against Fergie?

Klopp shows a bit of passionate disbelief at times, Arteta does it. It isn't an outdated Managerial trait. Winners win by all means possible. Pep Guardiola has even accused referees of double standards in the past.

In a bizarre decision against Spurs "The City boss replied: “Next question. I will not do a Mikel Arteta comment. “It is hard when you review the image, the referee decides to blow the whistle after he has already said to play on. After the pass, the whistle, so I do not understand this action.” 

24 minutes ago, diggerlad07 said:

I really really hope you are right but I expect it to be more signings like Gordon from Liverpool under 23s.  We need proven quality and those signings don't come cheap

 

Would Gordon be that bad? He’s played for Liverpool first team hasn’t he and is about the same age Ramsey was who we’d have took back in an instant and a similar point in his career to Mcatee who played a big part in sheff utds promotion.

We don’t ‘need’ to buy proven quality in every area, every team that gets promoted from this league does it with the help of the loan market, apart from outliers like Leicester. 
 

If we loan Gordon in January with a view to getting him back in summer then I’d say that’s a good deal. We could have a good player on the cheap and leave funds for elsewhere such as permanent deal for O’Brien or a new RB.
 

We’d all love a full team of proven quality players all of which are owned by the club but let’s be real it’s pretty difficult with our finances to pull that off. Unless we buy more players like Silvera and Engel and every single one of them turns out to be a hit.

classic Boro result after defying expectations the game before to concede from the only shot on target. Oh for a striker who can slot the ball into the onion sack! 

If we got just one goal getting loanee in January I think it would make a lot of difference, we just miss so many chances it's unreal. 

UTB!

2 hours ago, Redcar Rioja said:

Possession and stats like xG don't win games unfortunately.

They dont but we were the much better team and the only one who looked like winning. Poor finishing cost us unfortunately but just one of those days.

Don't think you can blame Carrick for the performance today as we did everything right barring the final touch, even breached their defence a few times.

Happens to everyone

Didn't watch the game but did listen, seemed like we had all chances and didn't score they got stroke of luck and won. These things happen to best of teams even Leicester when they played us should have scored twice before that superb free kick so not that upset about that.

Bring in players comfortable at playing out from back, stop zonal marking training defenders properly at man marking, bring in leadbitter type player with legs sell howson as his legs gone and buy/loan no 10 type player. If we do that playoffs spot is ours I reckon.

The theme this season when we really struggled is Howson gets bypassed as it's too quick, defenders didn't defend the zones properly and we don't close down at edge of box meaning everyone has pot shots against us. Occasionally we also get caught out playing out from back.

49 minutes ago, LinoJo3 said:

Would Gordon be that bad? He’s played for Liverpool first team hasn’t he and is about the same age Ramsey was who we’d have took back in an instant and a similar point in his career to Mcatee who played a big part in sheff utds promotion.

We don’t ‘need’ to buy proven quality in every area, every team that gets promoted from this league does it with the help of the loan market, apart from outliers like Leicester. 
 

If we loan Gordon in January with a view to getting him back in summer then I’d say that’s a good deal. We could have a good player on the cheap and leave funds for elsewhere such as permanent deal for O’Brien or a new RB.
 

We’d all love a full team of proven quality players all of which are owned by the club but let’s be real it’s pretty difficult with our finances to pull that off. Unless we buy more players like Silvera and Engel and every single one of them turns out to be a hit.

You make good points and I agree somewhat , but untested players signed in summer  wasn't the answer. I'd rather less quantity and better quality .

Crooks and coburn are brilliant back ups and having the odd untested isn't bad but we 5 or 6 untested offensive players and unfortunately thats where you win games.

Our only consistent 1 untested signing is is VDB and that's simply shocking window.

The problem is we're using average players who have average of 1 good game in 4 as our key players.

Our finances are good , I know the club spin the opposite but the past 4 windows have been really rewarding for this football club and not just in terms of sales.

We have a good core like you say and best manager in.league but I can't see him staying and just going round in circles under gibsons leadership

 

Edited December 26, 20232 yr by diggerlad07

3 minutes ago, OldManGravz said:

They dont but we were the much better team and the only one who looked like winning. Poor finishing cost us unfortunately but just one of those days.

Don't think you can blame Carrick for the performance today as we did everything right barring the final touch, even breached their defence a few times.

Happens to everyone

Poor Substitution timing, poor set pieces yet again. We had 11 corners to their none!

How long have we harped on about making Subs too late and our set pieces being diabolical?

2 minutes ago, diggerlad07 said:

You make good points and I agree somewhat , but untested players signed in summer  wasn't the answer. I'd rather less quantity and better quality .

Crooks and coburn are brilliant back ups and having the odd untested isn't bad but we have more or less a full 11 of untested players and the only consistent 1 is VDB.

The problem is we're using average players who have average of 1 good game in 4 as our key players.

Our finances are good , I know the club spin the opposite but the past 4 windows have been really rewarding for this football club and not just in terms of sales.

 

I get what you’re saying but can you compare Gordon, a player who got himself into Liverpool first team picture, to Silvera and rogers? Yes he’s still unproven but at least has some signs showing he’s less of a gamble.

3 minutes ago, Redcar Rioja said:

Poor Substitution timing, poor set pieces yet again. We had 11 corners to their none!

How long have we harped on about making Subs too late and our set pieces being diabolical?

Why are you so obsessed with the subs? We were dominating the game and making plenty of chances, why would he need to make wholesale changes when apart from the finishing the game plan was working fine?

Just now, LinoJo3 said:

I get what you’re saying but can you compare Gordon, a player who got himself into Liverpool first team picture, to Silvera and rogers? Yes he’s still unproven but at least has some signs showing he’s less of a gamble.

I'd say he's exactly like both of those players yes. You are right though he could be better than both silvera and Co.

Vasquez is something of the model I think we should be looking at.

 

10 minutes ago, Redcar Rioja said:

Poor Substitution timing, poor set pieces yet again. We had 11 corners to their none!

How long have we harped on about making Subs too late and our set pieces being diabolical?

We know set pieces are poor, I'll give you that. But we were still creating chances and breaching their defence throughout the game. What we were doing with the team we had out was working up until the finish and we just needed a bit more luck, we even hit the post twice!

Theres no guarantee that any substitutions wouldn't affect the flow of the game negatively either. Honestly reading through some of the comments you've made it just looks like you're looking for any stick to beat Carrick with when the truth is today it really wasn't his fault

3 minutes ago, diggerlad07 said:

I'd say he's exactly like both of those players yes. You are right though he could be better than both silvera and Co.

Vasquez is something of the model I think we should be looking at.

 

I think we could get both since Gordon would be a loan. If the options were buy Vasquez and loan Gordon vs Buy 2 Roger’s types would you look at it the same? Loaning a gamble so we can buy a more proven player in an important position is fair game imo.

3 minutes ago, LinoJo3 said:

Why are you so obsessed with the subs? We were dominating the game and making plenty of chances, why would he need to make wholesale changes when apart from the finishing the game plan was working fine?

Despite all the stats the game plan wasn't working fine and I said so at half time. The game ended the first half with the atmosphere subdued and we started the second half in an equally subdued manner. I said if Carrick didn't change something at 45 then it would end up,0-0 or worse still we would lose to a 40 yard Worldy. As it happens it was even worse than a Worldy.

For all our possession and opportunities it wasn't working. When Carrick rolled the dice the game was in the dying seconds, if it was the right decision to try something different then, then why not earlier? We aren't going to agree, I'm not totally convinced by Carrick, many are and I understand why but I keep seeing the same frustrations.