Stoke v Boro 2-0

[ManBearPig 2,324 4.2k]

If we can’t get up for it against Stoke who were woeful and a Plymouth side *** away from home, why on earth are people kidding themselves that we will be up for it against Norwich and QPR?
 

I think we lose the next two and Carrick is gone a week today after losing to qpr. 

[TheJew 3,662 6.1k]

11 minutes ago, ManBearPig said:

If we can’t get up for it against Stoke who were woeful and a Plymouth side *** away from home, why on earth are people kidding themselves that we will be up for it against Norwich and QPR?
 

I think we lose the next two and Carrick is gone a week today after losing to qpr. 

I think 2 further defeats and Carrick's position becomes untenable.

[TeaCider24 18,385 23.4k]

7 hours ago, Smogzilla said:

Might need a stadium ban if the boys pull it off today 🤣

I bought a video pass and watched it on my phone whilst working, so I messed it up for us all.

Missed loads of it too, so I only really caught the Stoke goals. Great use of funds.

[Changing Times 16,078 23.1k]

1 hour ago, Fab4TT said:

How about today pet? 38% to 62%. 

Ok but what has what a manager said about a Middlesbrough side under a different manager got to do with the Boro side today?  That's the bit I'm confused about.

[BoroDave4 1,655 3.5k]

Another limp, uninspiring performance bereft of determination or willingness from the players. The only performance in the last 5 that has been worthy of any praise was against Leicester. 

Was that because they can get themselves up for it against the league leaders? Or was it the tactics/formation? 

I don't know the answer, but the way we've performed lately has been boring, lacking in quality and effort and honestly draining to force myself to watch. 

None of those things could be aimed at this side last season under Carrick

So what has changed?

[Oslo_Syd 323 2.1k]

This was another car crash waiting to happen really, and I don’t think Carrick is entirely to blame, if at all.

[Changing Times 16,078 23.1k]

2 hours ago, ManBearPig said:

 

Out of interest, why would you keep Carrick ? What are you seeing that you think is worth keeping?

I suppose it's because I think he has shown that he can get us playing in a way that is both effective, and pleasing to watch.  To me, if you're looking at the current situation then you can split the problems into more than area of responsibility.  The single biggest issue this season is that we ended up with a worse squad than last season.  That's not down to Carrick.  A bigger squad possibly but with less quality.  This is supposition on my part but I don't believe he was all that happy with what we did last summer.  I feel like the chopping and changing of the team right from the start is evidence of this rather than evidence of his own incompetence.  Now, that's not to say he's blameless because he isn't.  He is making some really odd decisions or at least they look really odd from the outside without much context to place them in.  But I'd like to think that with better players he wouldn't be making as many odd decisions because he wouldn't be placed in the position of having to make them at all.  I wouldn't be giving him a contract extension but that's because I don't believe he's earned it, and I'm a lot less bothered about losing someone for doing well than I am for doing badly, if you see what I mean?

The problem is that we'll never know what this season was meant to be unless certain people come out and tell us.  Whilst we can all say it's disappointing, without knowing what the aims were it's difficult to say just how disappointing it is.  What I will say, and this is veering off the topic slightly, but if Gibson is more annoyed about the fans reactions to the ticket prices than he is to how we've played this season then he needs his head examining. 

[Oslo_Syd 323 2.1k]

5 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

I suppose it's because I think he has shown that he can get us playing in a way that is both effective, and pleasing to watch.  To me, if you're looking at the current situation then you can split the problems into more than area of responsibility.  The single biggest issue this season is that we ended up with a worse squad than last season.  That's not down to Carrick.  A bigger squad possibly but with less quality.  This is supposition on my part but I don't believe he was all that happy with what we did last summer.  I feel like the chopping and changing of the team right from the start is evidence of this rather than evidence of his own incompetence.  Now, that's not to say he's blameless because he isn't.  He is making some really odd decisions or at least they look really odd from the outside without much context to place them in.  But I'd like to think that with better players he wouldn't be making as many odd decisions because he wouldn't be placed in the position of having to make them at all.  I wouldn't be giving him a contract extension but that's because I don't believe he's earned it, and I'm a lot less bothered about losing someone for doing well than I am for doing badly, if you see what I mean?

The problem is that we'll never know what this season was meant to be unless certain people come out and tell us.  Whilst we can all say it's disappointing, without knowing what the aims were it's difficult to say just how disappointing it is.  What I will say, and this is veering off the topic slightly, but if Gibson is more annoyed about the fans reactions to the ticket prices than he is to how we've played this season then he needs his head examining. 

Sadly, I think that accountants have more say in the running of the club than the chairman or the manager.

[LinoJo3 5,823 13.6k]

56 minutes ago, ManBearPig said:

If we can’t get up for it against Stoke who were woeful and a Plymouth side *** away from home, why on earth are people kidding themselves that we will be up for it against Norwich and QPR?
 

I think we lose the next two and Carrick is gone a week today after losing to qpr. 

Right now that QPR game had the potential to be season definingly horrible.

[Changing Times 16,078 23.1k]

44 minutes ago, TheJew said:

I think 2 further defeats and Carrick's position becomes untenable.

If the stuff in the papers is true about the contract negotiations then no that's not going to be the case.

[LinoJo3 5,823 13.6k]

7 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

If the stuff in the papers is true about the contract negotiations then no that's not going to be the case.

Surely it has to be the case if we find our selves 3 points from the bottom 3 or worse.

[TheJew 3,662 6.1k]

8 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

If the stuff in the papers is true about the contract negotiations then no that's not going to be the case.

We will have to just wait and see.

[Changing Times 16,078 23.1k]

Just now, LinoJo3 said:

Surely it has to be the case if we find our selves 3 points from the bottom 3 or worse.

Why?  If we are looking to give him a contract extension then what difference does two defeats mean in the great scheme of things?  Either you believe in the bloke or you don't.  It's not like things have been going brilliantly, and we've been hoodwinked into offering an extension.  But that's if what is being reported is true of course, which it might not be.

[Changing Times 16,078 23.1k]

1 minute ago, TheJew said:

We will have to just wait and see.

I think we've been here before mate, haven't we?  If Gibson goes from wanting to extend his contract to sacking him in the space of two or three games then he isn't thinking rationally.

[TheJew 3,662 6.1k]

16 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

I suppose it's because I think he has shown that he can get us playing in a way that is both effective, and pleasing to watch.  To me, if you're looking at the current situation then you can split the problems into more than area of responsibility.  The single biggest issue this season is that we ended up with a worse squad than last season.  That's not down to Carrick.  A bigger squad possibly but with less quality.  This is supposition on my part but I don't believe he was all that happy with what we did last summer.  I feel like the chopping and changing of the team right from the start is evidence of this rather than evidence of his own incompetence.  Now, that's not to say he's blameless because he isn't.  He is making some really odd decisions or at least they look really odd from the outside without much context to place them in.  But I'd like to think that with better players he wouldn't be making as many odd decisions because he wouldn't be placed in the position of having to make them at all.  I wouldn't be giving him a contract extension but that's because I don't believe he's earned it, and I'm a lot less bothered about losing someone for doing well than I am for doing badly, if you see what I mean?

The problem is that we'll never know what this season was meant to be unless certain people come out and tell us.  Whilst we can all say it's disappointing, without knowing what the aims were it's difficult to say just how disappointing it is.  What I will say, and this is veering off the topic slightly, but if Gibson is more annoyed about the fans reactions to the ticket prices than he is to how we've played this season then he needs his head examining. 

I agree with a lot of this. The transfer strategy to this day baffles me.

It's not even a money issue necessarily, as other teams appear to sign really decent (or even bang average) players for nominal fees, whilst our scattergun approach seems to lack care, thought and strategy.

We haven't really replaced any of the players that left with anyone close to having similar skill sets.

The only real quality has been Rogers and RVB, everyone else still has a massive question mark over their head even at this time in the season.

Our best players remain those from last season.

The loan signings are even more baffling.

All season it has felt that Carrick doesn't know his best 11. He was given too much tripe and not enough quality.