Howson and Sainz went for a 50/50, Sainz thought Jonny was too rough and kicked out catching him on the thigh (allegedly). Right in front of ref so by the book, definitely a red and if it is overturned on appeal, would be surprised

Edited March 7, 20242 yr by Old Codger

I'm glad that Carrick switched to the 5-2-1-2. Though, we were still opened up with some good play by Norwich at times before their sending off. For the first 30 minutes it was clear that Norwich we're in a very good vein with the way the dominated possession and looked incredible comfortable. Step forward Sainz to ruin their night by getting sent off incredibly cheaply; if it wasn't for that there was no chance of us coming back. We got lucky but still handled it well - especially considering our terrible form and lack of confidence. It's obviously a lot easier to play against 10 men but I was really impressed with our wing play as we got outside them very well to stretch play and create some good quality chances. To turn it around so quickly with a lead going into half-time deserves praise, and also with our game management in the second-half as we recycled the ball really effectively to control the game and demoralise Norwich. Often teams on poor form need one game like this to act as a kick-start so hopefully the win can get some confidence going in the team to kick-start a good run of form. We created a lot of clear-cut chances and took them well. There was some rustiness and a bit of indecision between the spaces but that's to be expected with the switch of system and poor form. I really hope Carrick sticks with the system for the rest of the season as it suits our players best and we should only get better as the players adapt further to it.

In terms of individual performances everyone did pretty well. Ayling got humiliated for the first 30 minutes - which is becoming customary whenever we're playing 11 v 11 - but thankfully improved afterwards. Engel struggled early on but really grew into the game and put some fantastic balls into the box. This system should bring the best out of him. It would also really suit Jones who was incredible within Wilder's 3-5-2 system. I consider Jones to be a decent Championship standard winger but a very good standard Championship RWB. Jones and Engel as wingbacks would give us a huge attacking threat from out wide so I'd like to see that when Jones is back up to full fitness. Howson knitted everything together really well to help to ball flow through the team. 

I really didn't like the audible boos that Barlaser received when he came on. Anyone who boos their own players, especially when they're coming on while we're winning 3-1, is an idiot. The last thing a player low on confidence needs is to be booed.

4 minutes ago, p_mards said:

I really didn't like the audible boos that Barlaser received when he came on. Anyone who boos their own players, especially when they're coming on while we're winning 3-1, is an idiot. The last thing a player low on confidence needs is to be booed.

I wasn't there tonight, and missed this on the box.  Idiots 🤦‍♂️

11 minutes ago, p_mards said:

I'm glad that Carrick switched to the 5-2-1-2. Though, we were still opened up with some good play by Norwich at times before their sending off. For the first 30 minutes it was clear that Norwich we're in a very good vein with the way the dominated possession and looked incredible comfortable. Step forward Sainz to ruin their night by getting sent off incredibly cheaply; if it wasn't for that there was no chance of us coming back. We got lucky but still handled it well - especially considering our terrible form and lack of confidence. It's obviously a lot easier to play against 10 men but I was really impressed with our wing play as we got outside them very well to stretch play and create some good quality chances. To turn it around so quickly with a lead going into half-time deserves praise, and also with our game management in the second-half as we recycled the ball really effectively to control the game and demoralise Norwich. Often teams on poor form need one game like this to act as a kick-start so hopefully the win can get some confidence going in the team to kick-start a good run of form. We created a lot of clear-cut chances and took them well. There was some rustiness and a bit of indecision between the spaces but that's to be expected with the switch of system and poor form. I really hope Carrick sticks with the system for the rest of the season as it suits our players best and we should only get better as the players adapt further to it.

In terms of individual performances everyone did pretty well. Ayling got humiliated for the first 30 minutes - which is becoming customary whenever we're playing 11 v 11 - but thankfully improved afterwards. Engel struggled early on but really grew into the game and put some fantastic balls into the box. This system should bring the best out of him. It would also really suit Jones who was incredible within Wilder's 3-5-2 system. I consider Jones to be a decent Championship standard winger but a very good standard Championship RWB. Jones and Engel as wingbacks would give us a huge attacking threat from out wide so I'd like to see that when Jones is back up to full fitness. Howson knitted everything together really well to help to ball flow through the team. 

I really didn't like the audible boos that Barlaser received when he came on. Anyone who boos their own players, especially when they're coming on while we're winning 3-1, is an idiot. The last thing a player low on confidence needs is to be booed.

I agree with all this post, we did look almost demoralised before the sending off, we had no answer for their pressing and couldn’t cope with the pace of the game. I do still think their goal was lucky af, it was bad defending yes but the ball moved VERY kindly for Barnes while he was practically on all fours. I actually blame Dieng for the goal tbh, if anyone had the perfect chance to clatter Barnes it was him but he just kind of dithered about.

That said after the sending off you could see the confidence starting to build and as you mention to get back in front within 13 minutes of the red card even against 10 men is pretty good, specially for a struggling team. 
 

After half time we were fully in control, passed the ball well, moved it quickly and we even seen some of the interchanges and 1 touch pass and move stuff we got used to seeing under Carrick. Yes it’s not as great as it would have been in a ‘proper game’, but it’s not like their defenders stopped trying. If this game had came on the Wednesday after the Leicester game people would be calling it a ‘solid’ performance or a ‘professional victory’.

In a weird way because we had so much of the ball I think this game highlighted almost all our issues. 
 

Engel. Unless he’s in a crossing area he has no idea what to do with the ball, our play constantly breaks down if he gets involved. He does have good technique, his finish was good and one of his crosses was absurdly good. However he just doesn’t contribute enough imo, he’s like Greenwood but at fullback.

Ayling. Not our player but highlights an area we can significantly improve. He also had no idea what to do with the ball and lost possession almost every time the ball went to him. You could see a bit of quality tho when he took the chance to do some ‘classic’ full back work, beat their full back and cross. We definately need a RB comfortable in a Carrick system though.

#10/second striker. With Lath sat on the last man we had zero presence in the middle attacking third, it’s no wonder so many of our players turn and pass backwards. There is just no viable passing option through the middle.

Plus points were O’Brien and McGree linking up nicely, if we can keep them together next season then we should.

That said I do agree the game itself didn’t really ‘prove’ anything and I’m not really confident about the qpr game. But at the same time I remember people saying similar stuff after that Southampton home game and that set us off on a nice unbeaten run so who knows.

As pretty much everyone has said , the sending off turned the game but the main thing is we took advantage of it and won the game. It's now time to realise that we are a reasonable championship side , too good to be in trouble but not good enough to get promoted. We have quite a lot of players that are top half championship level but need an injection of pace and quality , this summer, to challenge for promotion next year. All in all, though, the world is a brighter place this morning. 

1 hour ago, Hammy legend said:

As pretty much everyone has said , the sending off turned the game but the main thing is we took advantage of it and won the game. It's now time to realise that we are a reasonable championship side , too good to be in trouble but not good enough to get promoted. We have quite a lot of players that are top half championship level but need an injection of pace and quality , this summer, to challenge for promotion next year. All in all, though, the world is a brighter place this morning. 

Maybe so, but I suspect our wages bill is considerably bigger than a lot of other “reasonable championship sides”, not to mention our managers and coaches salaries?

9 minutes ago, ScarBoro said:

Maybe so, but I suspect our wages bill is considerably bigger than a lot of other “reasonable championship sides”, not to mention our managers and coaches salaries?

https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/championship-wage-bills-2023-24-leeds-leicester-southampton

We're 10th and that's before we shed crooks and Rogers wages. If we win our game in hand we're sitting in 10th. So we're about where we should be.

Been on a three day training course in order to renew my SIA licence so football hasn't been a priority, completely ignored the match and didn't even check the score until well after full time.

Pleasantly surprised, obviously the sending off changed everything but that's football. All we have to do now is build on this win at QPR on Saturday, a team we really should beat...but we've said that about a handful of teams this season!

32 minutes ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Been on a three day training course in order to renew my SIA licence so football hasn't been a priority, completely ignored the match and didn't even check the score until well after full time.

Which day do you learn how to say "not tonight mate", and "no trainers"?

The main hope from last night is as the game went on the connection between the players improved. Some of Clarke's defending anc passing was sublime. Things started to come off because the players believed.

Football is strange. Howson doing a captain's job and getting their players sent off changed the game. His interview on Tees was brilliant - basically saying the lad was stupid and the ref had no choice.

We should gain confidence from tonight. The next 2 away should be exciting. Like Norwich games, QPR matches tend to be exciting. Loads of goals etc. 

 

7 hours ago, p_mards said:

I'm glad that Carrick switched to the 5-2-1-2. Though, we were still opened up with some good play by Norwich at times before their sending off. For the first 30 minutes it was clear that Norwich we're in a very good vein with the way the dominated possession and looked incredible comfortable. Step forward Sainz to ruin their night by getting sent off incredibly cheaply; if it wasn't for that there was no chance of us coming back. We got lucky but still handled it well - especially considering our terrible form and lack of confidence. It's obviously a lot easier to play against 10 men but I was really impressed with our wing play as we got outside them very well to stretch play and create some good quality chances. To turn it around so quickly with a lead going into half-time deserves praise, and also with our game management in the second-half as we recycled the ball really effectively to control the game and demoralise Norwich. Often teams on poor form need one game like this to act as a kick-start so hopefully the win can get some confidence going in the team to kick-start a good run of form. We created a lot of clear-cut chances and took them well. There was some rustiness and a bit of indecision between the spaces but that's to be expected with the switch of system and poor form. I really hope Carrick sticks with the system for the rest of the season as it suits our players best and we should only get better as the players adapt further to it.

In terms of individual performances everyone did pretty well. Ayling got humiliated for the first 30 minutes - which is becoming customary whenever we're playing 11 v 11 - but thankfully improved afterwards. Engel struggled early on but really grew into the game and put some fantastic balls into the box. This system should bring the best out of him. It would also really suit Jones who was incredible within Wilder's 3-5-2 system. I consider Jones to be a decent Championship standard winger but a very good standard Championship RWB. Jones and Engel as wingbacks would give us a huge attacking threat from out wide so I'd like to see that when Jones is back up to full fitness. Howson knitted everything together really well to help to ball flow through the team. 

I really didn't like the audible boos that Barlaser received when he came on. Anyone who boos their own players, especially when they're coming on while we're winning 3-1, is an idiot. The last thing a player low on confidence needs is to be booed.

Excellent post

Credit to Dieng who made two early saves, not to sure if they were both at 0-0 or the 2nd save with us losing

Thought Ayling was very lucky to get away with a tackle with his studs high when his poor control lost the ball at 0-0 

Engel was off it too at the start, Howson was consistent throughout with O'Brien my MOTM

I like Barlasar glad he came on & agree the little boos I heard, we sit in the east stand, were totally wrong

A team down to 10 men doesnt guarentee a win, think we deserve credit for hitting Norwich so early after their dismissal & again to lead, I used the word demoralised to my son in law at the game, thats how I seen it after ther player was sent off, they just caved in 

8 hours ago, Changing Times said:

Nobody is to say it except that there's no actual reason to think that we will.  We won a game a couple of weeks ago, and then turned in two of the worst performances of the season afterwards.  We were terrible tonight before Sainz was sent off.  While it was still a proper game we had nothing at all to offer.  I think there's a difference between ending a bad run of form with a good performance, and the hope that might bring future good performances, and what we saw tonight.  We need to play better to get results, it's as simple as that.  But it's been as simple as that for months to be fair.

My point wasn't a dig at fellow postets CF & agree, we've had a couple of games we've won well & then reverted back to type the following game, no, given the way we controlled the game after the sending off & the manner of the win, that looked unlikely with 11v11 then we have to take confidence from last nights performance in to the QPR game & who is to say we wont

1 hour ago, Neverbefore said:

https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/championship-wage-bills-2023-24-leeds-leicester-southampton

We're 10th and that's before we shed crooks and Rogers wages. If we win our game in hand we're sitting in 10th. So we're about where we should be.

You and your games in hand! We don't do it buddy we just don't do it!😉

14 minutes ago, edinboro said:

The main hope from last night is as the game went on the connection between the players improved. Some of Clarke's defending anc passing was sublime. Things started to come off because the players believed.

Football is strange. Howson doing a captain's job and getting their players sent off changed the game. His interview on Tees was brilliant - basically saying the lad was stupid and the ref had no choice.

We should gain confidence from tonight. The next 2 away should be exciting. Like Norwich games, QPR matches tend to be exciting. Loads of goals etc. 

 

Clarke was actually on the wing at one point last night, he had an excellent game 

8 minutes ago, edinboro said:

The main hope from last night is as the game went on the connection between the players improved. Some of Clarke's defending anc passing was sublime. Things started to come off because the players believed.

Football is strange. Howson doing a captain's job and getting their players sent off changed the game. His interview on Tees was brilliant - basically saying the lad was stupid and the ref had no choice.

We should gain confidence from tonight. The next 2 away should be exciting. Like Norwich games, QPR matches tend to be exciting. Loads of goals etc. 

 

Don't want to wee on everyones happiness...but until the sending off we were getting battered...You could see confidence returning...Having said that I think Norwich would have run out of steam...You can see It's a confidence thing