Carrick

[AnglianRed 7,823 18k]

Ugh. This is ugly.

I'm going to put my marker down and say the West Brom game will be another defeat.

For starters they're going to have the new manager bounce. The players will (or should be) busting a gut to prove themselves to the new boss. Then you've got Mogga, who's been a recent guest at the Riverside. He's seen how we play...how Carrick sets us up. Its going to be a case of the wise old veteran outfoxing the (relative) newbie.

We're on a hiding to nothing here and tbh I think its unfair to expect Boro to get anything from this game, all things considered. But I suppose the fans will do what they want. If they want to boo and make the atmosphere toxic I guess thats their right. I can understand it from a POV of the underwhelming season we've had as a whole.

 

I have to admit I'm finally at the point where I hope Scott is reviewing his list of potential new managers.

 

I really like Carrick and I was convinced we had finally hit upon an exciting young manager who could take us to the promised land, after that first season. While injuries have undeniably hampered his ability to field his preferred starting XI, there have been far too many points lost through draws or defeats in games that we could reasonably expected to have won. The most glaring and painful examples being the Sheffield Wednesday and Norwich games, where we contrived to blow comfortable leads.

- He's (mostly) persisted in trying to play the same style of football, even in the face of overwhelming evidence of teams being able to easily counter it

- He's done little or nothing to rectify our defensive frailty

- Our players seem to be very weak mentally and unable to maintain composure or co-ordination when put under pressure by opponents

- When faced with injuries he has a tendency to put round pegs in square holes, instead of looking at the wider squad or even youth team players (using Burgzorg as a striker and VDB as a full-back as just 2 examples)

- When making substitutes he often pulls the better-performing players and too often makes like for like subs when the situation calls for something different

- Boro are such a Jekyll & Hyde team. One game we can look amazing...the next its like we pulled 11 strangers off the street who have never played football before.

 

Over the last couple of seasons I've not seen anything to indicate that either he or the players are progressing and improving. Our results seem to be very much hit and miss and reliant on individual players being able to get the better of their opposite numbers, rather than a cohesive team plan.

 

Incredibly, despite all this, Boro are still in the mix for the play-offs...although more results like today and we can kiss them goodbye. I don't think there is any point in sacking Carrick this season, just to make a vain and pointless late dash for a top 6 place. We're clearly not ready to be promoted (without doing a Nottingham Forest anyway).

I'd rather see us bring someone in at the end of the season so they can have a full Summer & pre-season to implement their methods.

[RiseAgainst 4,807 3.9k]

12 hours ago, AnglianRed said:

Ugh. This is ugly.

I'm going to put my marker down and say the West Brom game will be another defeat.

For starters they're going to have the new manager bounce. The players will (or should be) busting a gut to prove themselves to the new boss. Then you've got Mogga, who's been a recent guest at the Riverside. He's seen how we play...how Carrick sets us up. Its going to be a case of the wise old veteran outfoxing the (relative) newbie.

We're on a hiding to nothing here and tbh I think its unfair to expect Boro to get anything from this game, all things considered. But I suppose the fans will do what they want. If they want to boo and make the atmosphere toxic I guess thats their right. I can understand it from a POV of the underwhelming season we've had as a whole.

 

I have to admit I'm finally at the point where I hope Scott is reviewing his list of potential new managers.

 

I really like Carrick and I was convinced we had finally hit upon an exciting young manager who could take us to the promised land, after that first season. While injuries have undeniably hampered his ability to field his preferred starting XI, there have been far too many points lost through draws or defeats in games that we could reasonably expected to have won. The most glaring and painful examples being the Sheffield Wednesday and Norwich games, where we contrived to blow comfortable leads.

- He's (mostly) persisted in trying to play the same style of football, even in the face of overwhelming evidence of teams being able to easily counter it

- He's done little or nothing to rectify our defensive frailty

- Our players seem to be very weak mentally and unable to maintain composure or co-ordination when put under pressure by opponents

- When faced with injuries he has a tendency to put round pegs in square holes, instead of looking at the wider squad or even youth team players (using Burgzorg as a striker and VDB as a full-back as just 2 examples)

- When making substitutes he often pulls the better-performing players and too often makes like for like subs when the situation calls for something different

- Boro are such a Jekyll & Hyde team. One game we can look amazing...the next its like we pulled 11 strangers off the street who have never played football before.

 

Over the last couple of seasons I've not seen anything to indicate that either he or the players are progressing and improving. Our results seem to be very much hit and miss and reliant on individual players being able to get the better of their opposite numbers, rather than a cohesive team plan.

 

Incredibly, despite all this, Boro are still in the mix for the play-offs...although more results like today and we can kiss them goodbye. I don't think there is any point in sacking Carrick this season, just to make a vain and pointless late dash for a top 6 place. We're clearly not ready to be promoted (without doing a Nottingham Forest anyway).

I'd rather see us bring someone in at the end of the season so they can have a full Summer & pre-season to implement their methods.

Apart from the very last sentence, I agree wholeheartedly with this. My only caveat would be that waiting til the summer to bring someone in means they have relatively limited time to assess the squad (especially in competitive matches) to determine how to tackle our persistent mental fragility.

But yes, we're making no progress. It's maddening. And in this abnormally weak league, it's also a shocking missed opportunity.

[AnglianRed 7,823 18k]

27 minutes ago, RiseAgainst said:

Apart from the very last sentence, I agree wholeheartedly with this. My only caveat would be that waiting til the summer to bring someone in means they have relatively limited time to assess the squad (especially in competitive matches) to determine how to tackle our persistent mental fragility.

But yes, we're making no progress. It's maddening. And in this abnormally weak league, it's also a shocking missed opportunity.

Lol - I meant Spring / end of season, so they have the Summer transfer window and close season to work in. 😁

[Swifty 254 264]

Having slept on it I’m more inclined to keep Michael until the end of the season.

[Plastic Goat 565 875]

Carrick's future at Boro depends on what the atmosphere is like at the next two home games. It could get very nasty indeed. Especially after the Sunderland game. Sunderland will be all fired up for this one.Will Boro?

[AllBoro10 3,061 3.6k]

Tuesday is huge for me. I need to some bloody desire to win from the team.

[Boro 86 738 2.6k]

I would definitely keep MC but agree this will either make or break him as a manager.

The other point for me is that the obvious replacement has got a new job 2 days ago !

 

[TeaCider24 17,172 22.4k]

I'm not sure if it'll be make or break for the club, but I do think it could be a tipping point with many fans.

I'm still Carrick in, despite the frustrations, but we've not won a game at home in well over a month, whilst we've repeatedly dropped points to some of the worst teams in the league and I think it's going to be an incredibly flat atmosphere on Tuesday, I could see it turning really sour if we lose.

Probably a harsh game for fans to turn on, given it's against a decent team with a decent manager, but I think they would.

[BillyWoofs_shinpad 2,141 10.2k]

9 minutes ago, TeaCider24 said:

I'm not sure if it'll be make or break for the club, but I do think it could be a tipping point with many fans.

I'm still Carrick in, despite the frustrations, but we've not won a game at home in well over a month, whilst we've repeatedly dropped points to some of the worst teams in the league and I think it's going to be an incredibly flat atmosphere on Tuesday, I could see it turning really sour if we lose.

Probably a harsh game for fans to turn on, given it's against a decent team with a decent manager, but I think they would.

If ever the team needed the fans on their side, it’s on Tuesday night. We need  positive attitude with no moaning and groaning when passes go astray. Even if we go in behind at half time, we need encouragement, not booing.
 

The fact that some people are saying that it’s going to be “toxic” on Tuesday evening really doesn’t help. people react far better to encouragement than they do criticism. The crowd has a massive part to play and I just hope they hold their nerve and stay positive. 

[TeaCider24 17,172 22.4k]

4 minutes ago, BillyWoofs_shinpad said:

If ever the team needed the fans on their side, it’s on Tuesday night. We need  positive attitude with no moaning and groaning when passes go astray. Even if we go in behind at half time, we need encouragement, not booing.
 

The fact that some people are saying that it’s going to be “toxic” on Tuesday evening really doesn’t help. people react far better to encouragement than they do criticism. The crowd has a massive part to play and I just hope they hold their nerve and stay positive. 

I don't think it's going to be toxic before kick-off, I think it's going to be incredibly flat, like it has been for a good while now.

I just think it'll turn toxic if it goes badly.

There's not been a great deal to cheer lately, but I still think our home crowd is reactive rather than proactive when it comes to support in the last few seasons.

A few dodgy refereeing decisions might wake people up or a good spell with a Boro goal, it usually does, but I'm not expecting a great atmosphere.

[Humpty 4,659 10.2k]

An early WBA goal and things will turn nasty.

[AllBoro10 3,061 3.6k]

A small part of me wishes Mowbray was in our dug out on Tuesday. Feel guilty for saying that too.

[Redcar Rioja 8,415 8.3k]

1 hour ago, Swifty said:

Having slept on it I’m more inclined to keep Michael until the end of the season.

I don't think it makes any difference if he stays or goes, if we were managerless I doubt we would be any worse off but possibly better (WBA coped OK with Brunt). Either way this team isn't going to win the Play Offs with him in charge, a busted flush who has reached his pinnacle, pretty good at times, even exciting but ultimately sadly just not good enough.

[BillyWoofs_shinpad 2,141 10.2k]

8 minutes ago, TeaCider24 said:

I don't think it's going to be toxic before kick-off, I think it's going to be incredibly flat, like it has been for a good while now.

I just think it'll turn toxic if it goes badly.

There's not been a great deal to cheer lately, but I still think our home crowd is reactive rather than proactive when it comes to support in the last few seasons.

A few dodgy refereeing decisions might wake people up or a good spell with a Boro goal, it usually does, but I'm not expecting a great atmosphere.

That’s a good way of putting it …reactive rather than proactive. The Boro faithful do seem to be a lot more negative these days compared to crowds in the past and indeed at other clubs. 
 

Maybe they feel that the team are underachieving, some would say that, although we are around where we normally are in the league at this time of year  

I don’t know, perhaps the crowd are over ambitious or unrealistic or maybe they just miss the days of AK when we knew that if we scored first we’d win.
 

One thing I would say is we are and always have been a strange team. Traditionally we play better against decent teams and struggle against lesser ones, it’s always been so, apart from during the Karanka years. Maybe we should focus on results rather than entertainment.
 

I like Carrick a lot, but he plays an incredibly complicated system, when it works, we look like Man City, when it doesn’t, the players all get in each others way as they did yesterday. We very often concede soon after making substitutions, it happened yet again yesterday. It makes me wonder if the substitutes are as on message with the game plan as the starting 11. 
 

I’m not sure what the solution is. I’d stick with Carrick, bring in a central midfielder who can step in to shore things up in a 3 when Azaz is ineffective. I’d hope Dieng is back in goal on Tuesday because I do feel that we defend very differently with Glover in goal, he doesn’t inspire confidence and he doesn’t help us play out from the back. 

[AllBoro10 3,061 3.6k]

Just now, BillyWoofs_shinpad said:

That’s a good way of putting it …reactive rather than proactive. The Boro faithful do seem to be a lot more negative these days compared to crowds in the past and indeed at other clubs. 
 

Maybe they feel that the team are underachieving, some would say that, although we are around where we normally are in the league at this time of year  

I don’t know, perhaps the crowd are over ambitious or unrealistic or maybe they just miss the days of AK when we knew that if we scored first we’d win.
 

One thing I would say is we are and always have been a strange team. Traditionally we play better against decent teams and struggle against lesser ones, it’s always been so, apart from during the Karanka years. Maybe we should focus on results rather than entertainment.
 

I like Carrick a lot, but he plays an incredibly complicated system, when it works, we look like Man City, when it doesn’t, the players all get in each others way as they did yesterday. We very often concede soon after making substitutions, it happened yet again yesterday. It makes me wonder if the substitutes are as on message with the game plan as the starting 11. 
 

I’m not sure what the solution is. I’d stick with Carrick, bring in a central midfielder who can step in to shore things up in a 3 when Azaz is ineffective. I’d hope Dieng is back in goal on Tuesday because I do feel that we defend very differently with Glover in goal, he doesn’t inspire confidence and he doesn’t help us play out from the back. 

I feel there is a lack of connection between Carrick and the fans I genuinely do. I think that's why it is reactive rather than proactive. 
 

his style of football is slow too so it really doesn't get the fans up for it which doesn't help.

 

You rarely ever hear any chants about Carrick. 
 

the atmosphere under Wilder at times was fantastic.