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O.K. then if you were in charge


 

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You have a business with a wage bill over £30 million.Overdraft charges,stadium and academy running costs.lets say in total £40 million.

Your income which last year was £46 million is reduced to around £22 million because of the loss of T.V. money.What are your options

a]see if the bank will loan you £18 mill over the next year to cover losses.

b]Find £18 mill yourself to put in.

If a] and b] are not possible the only solution is to sell some assets and cut running costs which is what has happened.Tuncay was always going to go.I'm cheesed off with Huth's departure as much as anybody and perhaps if that Brazilian waste of oxygen had gone possibly we might have been able to hang on to him for a few months.

This is the economic reality of relegation.Newcastle have sold Bassong Martins Beye and Duff for exactly the same reason.

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you're right Sman.

 

I think it was worth a punt to try and get us straight back up again, but if it's your money you're thinking if that punt failed then we could bite the big biscuit in the sky and go under as a club.

 

I'm annoyed because "the player will go nowhere unless we get the right price" is easier to say than "there is nothing wrong with the club finances and we don't need to sell". While giving the media the same message, it doesn't lie to the fans.

 

past singings and sales have been hasty and il-advised that have led us to this situation. to be fair I like the look of lita, yeates is tidy too. if poggi can come back and be a ruthless dominator then maybe we won't be so bad off....

 

...unless there is more horror waiting to get in through the window that is....

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Ultimately we are paying for as Peter Ridsdale once put it "Living the dream" plus also some very bad decisions over the years that have accumulated us with these debts.

 

The club for a very longtime has been living beyond its means and eventually it would have to stop as Gibsons empire hasnt got a bottomless pit of money.

 

Im interested to see if Alves does actually leave, If he doesnt then we know its because the club havent persuaded him to stay and its because nobody wanted him apart from some team in the middle east.If this is the case then may be Huth was sold to bring in the money the club thought they would get for the sale of Alves.

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See Stocktonman you are starting with the premise that Gibson found himself in control of a club that had a massive wage bill, a declining support and had just been relegated.

 

Gibson's actual starting point as Boro chairman was he had a club that had been saved from those problems, with slightly different causes. They were solvent, owned their ground and were getting attendances ranging from 15-20,000 people.

 

I would give you the option you haven't given us. I would have listened to the man who had many, many more years experience than I. I would have followed his business plan based on socioeconomic trends in the area. I would have redeveloped an ageing stadium with a lower capacity that would have had reasonable running costs. I would have set my stall out, as per the business plan, to establish the club again and take a more risk aversive course of action. Really build a solid foundation to the club - and when I said I would not allow the club to get in that financial state again I would have meant it. I would have waited quite some time before committing to a new stadium and only if the cost benefits were worth it.

 

Fans would have been none the wiser and wouldn't have missed the highs that have now led us to this dire situation.

 

As usual those who seek to only see good in this mess miss the point entirely. We are in this mess because of Gibson and Lamb. That is why they took control because Henderson told them that a club our size could not sustain the dream Gibson had. They didn't like that a bought him out. The starting point of this isn't the economic collapse of last year. It started a few short years after we were saved from a similar situation.

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What really ***es me off is very simple: The fans are lied to CONSTANTLY. If we were told at the start of summer that the finances were still in a mess, instead of being told we have the financial power to compete, we would have been prepared for this and the backlash that has resulted would not have been so harsh. As well as this, the past few weeks we have been told that Huth does not have to be sold for any financial reasons and that we really want him to stay.. yet we sell him for zero profit. It all stinks of lies and cover ups.

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For me the most accomplished defender we had last season was Riggott, I think his injury had a huge detrimental affect on the team. I also think Pogz will be solid in this division, it's key to get these 2 fit.

After that Hines and Grounds have shown huge promise as replacements. I don't think the Huth sale is that catastrophic.

We've been getting used to the fact that Tuncay was going to go. It is frustrating that we have a number of poor players that we can't offload.

 

Following relegation, I was expecting us to lose a lot more players; Bates, O'Neil, Pogz and Johnson on top of the ones that have gone. I don't think our squad is in the worst position imaginable and we've managed to generate some cash and reduce our wage bill... needs must!

I think the reaction from some has been a bit too extreme claiming this is the end of out promotion charge (apart from Sheff Utd who we didn't beat, we've played inferior teams), sack the board...etc. There is a long season ahead of us, wish we could remain a bit more positive rather than turning into geordies and just having a whinge... keep the faith!

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Captain it's easy to be wise after the event.Frankly I've had a wonderful time following my team to Cup finals and into Europe which as a lad I never believed I'd see.Unfortunately the bills have now come in so there is some [hopefully ]short term pain.

Every team that gets relegated now and has players on big money is going to face exactly the same scenario as we are.Take a deep breath for a bit of a bumpy ride.

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I don't think I am being wise after the event, but you are asking us to choose something that Gibson didn't have to choose. In your scenario we would be acting wise after the event. This is something that is thrown back at us who question whats going on every time what we say comes to fruition. Wise after the event usually involves not spotting the obvious before it happens.

 

Henderson wasn't wise after the event - he told Gibson exactly what would happen, Gibson ignored that. So how do you justify that? You can argue your case with me because you only have my word that I didn't think the moves was a good one. Not that I haven't enjoyd it. Gibson though was told by a business man with a wealth of experience and a solid business plan based on good research. How can you argue hindsight in the real world when the information was there? How?

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I actually believe that the move to the new stadium was the catalyst for our success and may well have not happened otherwise.We were one of the first new grounds and at the time it and Gibbo's investment put us on the map.Anyway mate I'm off to bed. Let's hope tommorow doesn't give us a heart attack!!!!!

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See Stocktonman you are starting with the premise that Gibson found himself in control of a club that had a massive wage bill, a declining support and had just been relegated.

 

Gibson's actual starting point as Boro chairman was he had a club that had been saved from those problems, with slightly different causes. They were solvent, owned their ground and were getting attendances ranging from 15-20,000 people.

 

I would give you the option you haven't given us. I would have listened to the man who had many, many more years experience than I. I would have followed his business plan based on socioeconomic trends in the area. I would have redeveloped an ageing stadium with a lower capacity that would have had reasonable running costs. I would have set my stall out, as per the business plan, to establish the club again and take a more risk aversive course of action. Really build a solid foundation to the club - and when I said I would not allow the club to get in that financial state again I would have meant it. I would have waited quite some time before committing to a new stadium and only if the cost benefits were worth it.

 

Fans would have been none the wiser and wouldn't have missed the highs that have now led us to this dire situation.

 

As usual those who seek to only see good in this mess miss the point entirely. We are in this mess because of Gibson and Lamb. That is why they took control because Henderson told them that a club our size could not sustain the dream Gibson had. They didn't like that a bought him out. The starting point of this isn't the economic collapse of last year. It started a few short years after we were saved from a similar situation.

Top post Captain could'nt have put it better myself.

Gibbo got us into this mess now let s see how low Boro are to sink because of it.

Rocky roads ahead hold onto that steering wheel.

Catch yers all in a few days off back to finish my hols.:D

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The problems as I see them are misplaced faith in managers. McClaren was allowed to bring in too many ageing players on top wages with little or no re-sell value. Then Southgate was appointed as a cheap alternative with a remit to lower the costbase and rejuvenate the squad. Theres nothing particularly wrong with that idea except that he had no experience whatsoever in management. Someone like Alan Curbishley or the like could have been brought in probably for not much more money than SG is on and kept the ship afloat while also doing the same trimming job.

 

The main issue is that when Southgate was entrusted with money, he didnt have the managerial experience to know what sort of players he should be bringing in, hence the expensive (failed) gambles on Alves and Mido (a*** many others - Euell, Shawky) and the sales of players that could have been nurtured better (Morrison, Cattermole). I believe he now has that experience (the signings of Yeates and Coyne would suggest so) but its been at a terrible cost.

 

Money was always going to be tight and I believe that we as a group would have responded much better if we had been told right at the start of the summer that we needed these sales. Its the shock and suddenness of losing a revitalised collossus in defence that has lead to these feelings of betrayal.

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Birdie - we certainly would't have been in the mess we are now. Sure we probably wouldn't have won a cup and been in europe. Equally we wouldn't be in the perilous position we now are. Gibson has taken us back to the brink of where his involvement began. He promised fans he would never let the club go there again, but he is a fan and just because he is a good business man doesn't mean he has seperated the two.

 

It is easy to criticise the Henderson plan because we did win a cup and we did play in Europe. If the Henderson plan had been followed we would have those times to miss and we would be sat here bemoning our luck as we went out of the cup the a last minute pentaly at Forest which was never a penalty. I would rather that than have no club.

 

I liked the honesty of Henderson - he was no fuss man who made calls for the right decisions not based on unsustainable dreams that all fans have for their club. He would have run the club well.

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