Non-Boro Football

[TeaCider24 12,639]

2 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

He wasn't on Friday.  I noticed that nobody really mentioned how easily they got down our right hand side.  Spence has looked good against two lots of Premier League opposition now, in fact he looked good against Spurs when we played them under Woodgate as well.  Jones struggled on Friday, certainly defensively, and only showed flashes of what he could do with the ball, although I would place the responsibility for that on the team in general rather than him.  Spence would walk into our team if we actually thought properly about it.  How many Premier League clubs do we think are watching the likes of Crooks and Dijksteel as an example?  None cos they will never be able to play at that level.  Spence clearly can get to that level, the issue for him is, and was, consistency.  He seems to have found that at Forest, maybe we should be asking why that is from our own perspective.  I hope someone at the club is doing that, and isn't just taking the view that Spence is the problem but somehow he's not a problem at Forest.

I hope they do too, but I expect his problem is with the area in general.

I will immediately hold my hands up and admit I'm wrong, if he does come back and play for us and put in good performances.

I don't expect him to though, he doesn't want to be here, and he hasn't for a while.

The issues started before Warnock was even here.

[Brunners 7,982]

3 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

He wasn't on Friday.  I noticed that nobody really mentioned how easily they got down our right hand side.  Spence has looked good against two lots of Premier League opposition now, in fact he looked good against Spurs when we played them under Woodgate as well.  Jones struggled on Friday, certainly defensively, and only showed flashes of what he could do with the ball, although I would place the responsibility for that on the team in general rather than him.  Spence would walk into our team if we actually thought properly about it.  How many Premier League clubs do we think are watching the likes of Crooks and Dijksteel as an example?  None cos they will never be able to play at that level.  Spence clearly can get to that level, the issue for him is, and was, consistency.  He seems to have found that at Forest, maybe we should be asking why that is from our own perspective.  I hope someone at the club is doing that, and isn't just taking the view that Spence is the problem but somehow he's not a problem at Forest.

Spences problem is, and always has been, his own attitude. Djed is playing well, if you were to be really cynical you would argue it's because he knows he's playing for a move. 

Djed has made it very clear he doesn't want to play for us & I hope someone at the club is figuring out just how much we can sell him for rather than bring a potential disruption back into the squad, regardless of how good he can be when his head is in it.

[Changing Times 12,347]

Just now, TeaCider24 said:

I hope they do too, but I expect his problem is with the area in general.

I will immediately hold my hands up and admit I'm wrong, if he does come back and play for us and put in good performances.

I don't expect him to though, he doesn't want to be here, and he hasn't for a while.

The issues started before Warnock was even here.

Based on what?

[TeaCider24 12,639]

1 minute ago, Changing Times said:

Will they forget ripping him to shreds beforehand I wonder.

Probably, I'm sure the same will happen if and when Connolly scores for us.

But I was very critical of Spence's performances for a while before he left, and I stand by all of them.

The irony is that he was finally playing well again just before he was loaned out.

[Changing Times 12,347]

Just now, Brunners said:

Spences problem is, and always has been, his own attitude. Djed is playing well, if you were to be really cynical you would argue it's because he knows he's playing for a move. 

Djed has made it very clear he doesn't want to play for us & I hope someone at the club is figuring out just how much we can sell him for rather than bring a potential disruption back into the squad, regardless of how good he can be when his head is in it.

Again, based on what?

Considering how little transfer information has been accurate, how is it that people know the internal workings of the club when it comes to this one particular player?  It's amazing how much stuff people seem to know these days.

[TeaCider24 12,639]

3 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

Based on what?

Based on him having publicly discussed attitude issues under two separate managers, and then making it clear that he didn't want to come back here when Wilder spoke to him.

This last point is my own personal opinion, but he also never looked happy when I saw him on the pitch or the sidelines.

 

 

 

[TLF10 4,496]

Martin Keown on BBC

Everything is going Forest's way. Djed Spence has really impressed me. He's on his loan from Middlesbrough. He's been sent away to clear his head and he's clearly doing that. He's like a Rolls-Royce.

[notjade 1,174]

11 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

He wasn't on Friday.  I noticed that nobody really mentioned how easily they got down our right hand side.  Spence has looked good against two lots of Premier League opposition now, in fact he looked good against Spurs when we played them under Woodgate as well.  Jones struggled on Friday, certainly defensively, and only showed flashes of what he could do with the ball, although I would place the responsibility for that on the team in general rather than him.  Spence would walk into our team if we actually thought properly about it.  How many Premier League clubs do we think are watching the likes of Crooks and Dijksteel as an example?  None cos they will never be able to play at that level.  Spence clearly can get to that level, the issue for him is, and was, consistency.  He seems to have found that at Forest, maybe we should be asking why that is from our own perspective.  I hope someone at the club is doing that, and isn't just taking the view that Spence is the problem but somehow he's not a problem at Forest.

He set up the goal and I think every other chance we had

[Brunners 7,982]

2 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

Again, based on what?

Considering how little transfer information has been accurate, how is it that people know the internal workings of the club when it comes to this one particular player?  It's amazing how much stuff people seem to know these days.

I know you don't use social media CT, but Spence hasn't exactly been particularly quiet on the subject, he quite clearly had some major problems with Boro. That's just the stuff in public and not including any of the whispers from behind the scenes.

At the end of the day, I'd rather sell a player that has already been replaced & doesn't want to be here to raise funds than have to sell a Fry, Tav or McNair who love playing for this club.

[Changing Times 12,347]

3 minutes ago, GrimsbyBoro said:

Imagine where we would be if we had kept Luke Williams, Andy Halliday. Brad Fewster, Steve Baker. Bryn Morris. Stephen Wearne 

What has that got to with this?  None of them looked even close to what we've seen out of Spence.  Williams looked bright when he first came through, but I think that was at least partly because he was fast-tracked through as a 16 year old, and there wasn't much else after that.  Halliday was never particularly good for us, Baker wasn't much of a player, Morris never developed out of youth football, Fewster and Wearne never came close to making it with us.  None of them had any outstanding abilities or potential.  Spence is very quick, physically can look after himself, and has just enough skill to give you something to work with.  Strange comparisons there mate tbh.

[Brunners 7,982]

1 minute ago, notjade said:

He set up the goal and I think every other chance we had

He did - was far and away our best offensive outlet on the night.

[Changing Times 12,347]

1 minute ago, notjade said:

He set up the goal and I think every other chance we had

I know he did, which is why I said he showed flashes.  We barely did anything with the ball mate, that's kinda my point.  But as I also said I don't place the responsibility for that on him, that was down to the whole team.  Defensively he struggled however.

[notjade 1,174]

2 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

I know he did, which is why I said he showed flashes.  We barely did anything with the ball mate, that's kinda my point.  But as I also said I don't place the responsibility for that on him, that was down to the whole team.  Defensively he struggled however.

I don't think he did too badly. He was up against their best player on the night in Sancho and Dijksteel behind him had a bit of a wobbler.

[Changing Times 12,347]

3 minutes ago, Brunners said:

I know you don't use social media CT, but Spence hasn't exactly been particularly quiet on the subject, he quite clearly had some major problems with Boro. That's just the stuff in public and not including any of the whispers from behind the scenes.

At the end of the day, I'd rather sell a player that has already been replaced & doesn't want to be here to raise funds than have to sell a Fry, Tav or McNair who love playing for this club.

How would you feel if you get grief constantly?  You get played out of position, then get blamed for anything and everything?  It's hard for me to think that he's been made to feel all that welcome.  He got into the side, people liked him, then his form dipped and he was hammered. 

I agree with you on the second bit, and I've accepted that we will be selling him.  I'm saying we'd be a better team with him in it than we are now, that's all.  He won't play for Boro again, I think that's absolutely clear.

[Changing Times 12,347]

1 minute ago, notjade said:

I don't think he did too badly. He was up against their best player on the night in Sancho and Dijksteel behind him had a bit of a wobbler.

Allowances that would never ever be made for Spence.  Jones did ok the few times we were able to get him involved, he didn't do much overall though.  But from reading some of the comments I think we obviously played better than I'd realised cos I thought we were lucky not to get battered.