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You're never going to get anything out of an attack when your frontman has scored 3 in nearly 50 games :P

 

I know what you mean but for me today was an example of why he isn't the problem.

 

Can I ask a general question to everyone. When you watch us play, do you know what we're trying to do in an attacking sense?

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Seems to always be get it wide but if it that fails cut in and pass back to keeper :P

 

I don't think we'll see any real plan until Karanka gets his frontline. Said it in another thread but we don't have many intelligent attackers. We have Tomlin and Ledesma in AM and Butterfield who is playing out of position.

 

I would actually like to see us play: Ledesma - Butterfield - Tomlin and see what happens. They certainly have the footballing brains needed.

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You're never going to get anything out of an attack when your frontman has scored 3 in nearly 50 games :P

 

I know what you mean but for me today was an example of why he isn't the problem.

 

Can I ask a general question to everyone. When you watch us play, do you know what we're trying to do in an attacking sense?

 

When Kamara is one of the wingers and Adomah has a bad day by his standards, no, it's very hard to see what the plan is. However, when carayol and adomahare in the team, and playing well, I think it's fairly easy what the teams main plan is for going forwards.

 

Hignett said in the supporters club meeting that Karanka sends the 3 attacking midfielders out with freedom and to be very fluid interchanging in their positions, he also said that AK gets very annoyed because most of them seem unable to do it, we need more intelligent attacking players in order for this system to work properly, one reason why I think Tomlin will be a very important player for us next season.

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A shirt pull isn't always a yellow, most of the time it is just a free kick.

 

He almost tore his shirt off it was that much of a pull though, so I can see why that one got booked.

 

hoyte, we're the main match on FLS apparently (hence the stream I think?) so you'll get all the major stuff :)

 

We could be the live match on sky sports and they'd still miss it ;)

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Seems to always be get it wide but if it that fails cut in and pass back to keeper :P

 

I don't think we'll see any real plan until Karanka gets his frontline. Said it in another thread but we don't have many intelligent attackers. We have Tomlin and Ledesma in AM and Butterfield who is playing out of position.

 

I would actually like to see us play: Ledesma - Butterfield - Tomlin and see what happens. They certainly have the footballing brains needed.

 

I'm really not convinced about Butterfield in that role. To me a number 10 should be an attacker whereas when I watch Butterfield I see a midfielder who wants to attack if that makes any sense? That would also be a fairly slow attacking trio as well although pace on it's own isn't the answer of course. I can see what you're doing there though, it's the blend that you're looking for.

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We have the pace on the left through Friend. The right is the problem but Ledesma has more than enough tricks to beat a player.

 

Butterfield is a stop gap. Ideally Tomlin would be there with someone else on the left with JB playing deeper with Chalobah but that isn't ever happening :P

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Hignett said in the supporters club meeting that Karanka sends the 3 attacking midfielders out with freedom and to be very fluid interchanging in their positions, he also said that AK gets very annoyed because most of them seem unable to do it, we need more intelligent attacking players in order for this system to work properly, one reason why I think Tomlin will be a very important player for us next season.

 

I must have missed that, has it been posted on the forum, Will?

 

So isn't that Karanka getting it wrong then? If we don't have players to do it then why persist with it? I don't see Adomah as someone that will interchange with other players. He's a fairly orthodox right winger. Even Ledesma is essentially a right sided player albeit a left footed one but he doesn't tend to be effective anywhere else. Are we trying to be too sophisticated for the level we're at and the players we have and are likely to have at our disposal?

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We seem to try and be more of a counter attack side that exploits the wings where we will break fast and not over pass. It's clear that we're not very purposeful in attack, which I think is mainly down to players not fitting the system as well as better/different players would.

 

When Carayol was fit the vast majority of our attacks would come from deep driving runs by him cutting inside which would drag players out of position and open up space for us to exploit with a pass or to get a shot off. Our right side of the team doesn't have anywhere near the attacking intent, which is probably down to Varga being limited on the ball and a predominantly right footed RW like Adomah that isn't suited to moving infield and drag players out of position. We would be better balanced if we had a technically good left footer to cut inside fromt he right and drag opposition players out of position to open up space to play through, like we do well on the left flank so well with Carayol and Friend. Also with a RB behind him that is far better on the ball. Today attacking wise we were awful and looked like we had no plan.

 

The team needs improvements making in the summer, that's for sure.

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Yeah Butterfield is a deeper sitting CM that can see passes and spray it out up towards the front guys.

 

I agree with Prowler.

 

Ideally I'd like a CM of Butterfield and Chalobah/whitehead (basically a more defensive one)

 

This gives Butters the ability to sit deeper and spot any of our wide guys or Tomlin through the middle.

 

CT: The reason we persist with it is because it's best to stamp our identity on the team now and then in the summer you can say "hey look, we play this way, you'd be perfect for our system". Rather than "hey look we will play thay way but no one in our team has any experience with it so at the start of the season everyone will be terrible"

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Plus it gives the players we currently have a chance to settle and adapt to their instructions over time. If they haven't got it by the summer, get shot. If they show that they have the potential to adapt their game to fit the system, then great.

 

There's no point us changing how we're going to be playing next season for the last few games of this season, not when there's nowt to play for.

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Yeah Butterfield is a deeper sitting CM that can see passes and spray it out up towards the front guys.

 

I agree with Prowler.

 

Ideally I'd like a CM of Butterfield and Chalobah/whitehead (basically a more defensive one)

 

This gives Butters the ability to sit deeper and spot any of our wide guys or Tomlin through the middle.

 

CT: The reason we persist with it is because it's best to stamp our identity on the team now and then in the summer you can say "hey look, we play this way, you'd be perfect for our system". Rather than "hey look we will play thay way but no one in our team has any experience with it so at the start of the season everyone will be terrible"

 

I did think today that I would like to have seen Butterfield left on but dropped back in an effort to get him and us on the ball more purposefully through the middle. Also like to see if he can work with Tomlin but Karanka clearly wouldn't take the risk.

 

What you're saying is perfectly reasonable but it's clearly not working and the players aren't doing what they're being told so the team has no identity at all, going forward at least. Defensively we're reasonably solid. As we seem to be saying the current attacking players will be moved on then their experience will be largely irrelevant come next season. In any case we need more than one approach and way of playing, if only to make sure we're not predictable.

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Hignett said in the supporters club meeting that Karanka sends the 3 attacking midfielders out with freedom and to be very fluid interchanging in their positions, he also said that AK gets very annoyed because most of them seem unable to do it, we need more intelligent attacking players in order for this system to work properly, one reason why I think Tomlin will be a very important player for us next season.

 

I must have missed that, has it been posted on the forum, Will?

 

So isn't that Karanka getting it wrong then? If we don't have players to do it then why persist with it? I don't see Adomah as someone that will interchange with other players. He's a fairly orthodox right winger. Even Ledesma is essentially a right sided player albeit a left footed one but he doesn't tend to be effective anywhere else. Are we trying to be too sophisticated for the level we're at and the players we have and are likely to have at our disposal?

 

No it hasn't been posted on here and given the reaction to someone posting a summary of it on FMTTM, I'm not prepared to and I'm fairly confident viv, the one who got his knuckles wrapped for posting it, won't want to either.

 

He basically said that the front four are given complete freedom to go out and play but they aren't doing it and everybody is frustrated by it.

 

In answer to your other question, I'm really not sure whose getting it wrong, Karanka could be a bit more flexible but if this is the formation and system that he believes will work then I believe he should persevere simply to see which of our players are worth keeping after this season. If he is sending them out like that then I presume they train like that and if the players aren't doing what they are being told to then I believe it is their fault for not carrying out some pretty simple instructions.

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We function well as a unit in my opinion. But we're missing some of the most important ingredients that all good sides have. Namely a goalscorer and consistent cutting edge. Until that's amended, we will continue to drop lots and lots of points, regardless of whether we play well or poorly.

 

We've looked like a reasonably good team in a fair number (but obviously not all) of our games recently (like a team that wouldn't look out of place a***st or at least nearer the top 6). But we don't create enough clear cut chances, and when we get then we don't score anywhere near enough.

 

Today, for instance, we played an out of form but top 3 QPR team who, though looked good at times, were generally very average. They had a hell of a lot of luck, granted, but one of the biggest differences is that they have players who regularly thump it home when the opportunity arises, or who can do something special.

 

We don't. Certainly not consistently.

 

I'm fully behind AK and think he is the right man for the job. I just hope that he has some tricks up his sleeve in the Summer transfer window.

 

By and large, I think this is the fairest general analysis I've read so far. I would add that, apart from a few purple patches, which were a pleasure to watch, we simply didn't look sharp enough to get a result. I wouldn't single out any players for particular criticism with the exception of Graham, who simply didn't take his chances - particularly when Tomlin fed him a perfect through ball. In the second half, it looked as if someone had slipped bromide in their tea. I couldn't believe I was watching the same team. Maybe it was a 'nothing to play for' mentality, but if so it's not good enough.

We desperately need a striker who we can count on to take advantage of opportunities.

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The best teams in the division are greater than the sum of their parts (Burnley especially) - I can't think of many games this season where we've flattered to deceive.

 

Truth is, we are an average team and constantly blaming referees or bad luck just highlights our weaknesses. Over a season, you remember the decisions which go against rather than the ones we got in our favour which we shouldn't have had.

 

As for injuries, every team has them to a greater or lesser degree over the season.

 

A few weeks ago we were 4th top scorers in the division, now we;re joint 14th - our goals against tells a better story where we're 6th best. It's easy to see where AK's priorities have been but if we don't score, we don't win.

 

Danny Graham is not going to do it for us - 3 goals in 50ish games is woeful and our priority in the close season is to get a couple of strikers (don't want Juke back).

 

Would love to see us start a season well for once and not have to face the prospect of mid table mediocrity for the first time in a few years - doubt it will happen though.

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Normally I'd agree with the old "they even out" and "you only remember the bad ones" but I'd put my house on us getting the short end of the stick way more than we've got the luck this season.

 

We've just had to much stuff go against us consistently week in and week out to it be any sort of even.

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