"KM" 1,656 Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 The same McClaren who's working wonders at Newcastle. If anything it's he who needs educating. ;) Give me one reason why we should persist with the 4231 formation other than the fact it's worked in the past, it has run its course over the last 5 games... because it has worked for the last 2 and a half years, have you ever kicked a football? But it hasn't worked in the last 5 games. We can't just carry on in the same manner hoping that it finally clicks again, we need to be proactive, just try something different. Its a blip, do you really think a 5 game bad spell warrants a complete overhaul of the system we have played for 2 years successfully? I'm just concerned we're going to persist with something that's run its course, I'm not convinced it's suddenly going to click again. Link to post Share on other sites
jamesp 125 Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 The same McClaren who's working wonders at Newcastle. If anything it's he who needs educating. ;) Give me one reason why we should persist with the 4231 formation other than the fact it's worked in the past, it has run its course over the last 5 games... because it has worked for the last 2 and a half years, have you ever kicked a football? But it hasn't worked in the last 5 games. We can't just carry on in the same manner hoping that it finally clicks again, we need to be proactive, just try something different. Its a blip, do you really think a 5 game bad spell warrants a complete overhaul of the system we have played for 2 years successfully? I'm just concerned we're going to persist with something that's run its course, I'm not convinced it's suddenly going to click again. Its the only way we know how to play and its the system that we have brought players to fit into, the vast majority of top teams around the world play with this system too. 4-4-2 doesnt work for us. I can see why people are worried but we looked much better against Leeds. I am 100% sure that we will win on Tuesday night and things will start to look alot better Link to post Share on other sites
JMC91 280 Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 The reason i'd stick to his system is because whenever we've tried something different, like going with 2 up top (apart from Brentford at home where I think we looked decent), or switching to 3 at the back when we've really been chasing a game, I think we've lost our shape and it's seemed as though the players didn't know what was required of them. The system we play is very regimented, the players know exactly what they're supposed to do and when it does work it's been incredibly effective, I think the clamour for the change to 2 up top is due to how frustrating the 4231 is to watch when things aren't going to plan, if we go behind or a team stifles us. Also I just can't see Karanka throwing his system out the window this far down the line, minor tweaks to attitude and personnel (like we saw with Adomah's when he came back in at Leeds), and the return of key figures like Friend and Ayala should see us back to good form in my opinion. Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,283 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Karanka isn't going to change the formation and I don't think he really should. These 5 games aren't just a case of teams figuring us out. It's a system that works and has worked for a long time. We just need our attacking players to get a bit more involved and get our best defenders back in the team. We've had one or two of Gibson, Friend and Ayala injured for most the past month or so. Gibson comes back and he's now been suspended. It can't have helped the players' mentality further up the pitch having lost those players. Continue to believe we will stop the rot. We weren't entirely clueless against Leeds, we were a bit average but we should have had a goal allowed and could have had another if Ramirez had belted the ball when it dropped to him. Those chances came to us with the system still in place, as opposed to the goals against Blackburn and MK Dons which came about due to changing to a more direct approach in general. I'm willing to believe we've utilised our week long break much better this time round, we'll come back home for the Cardiff game much more motivated and full of energy. What's much better though is we are now definitely going to have a good run of games. 6 games in 3 weeks before a near full week break before Hull at home, back to the usual tempo of the Championship. I don't think the Hull game can be postponed regardless of whether they get through against ***nal in the cup, the quarter finals are the week before that game. Link to post Share on other sites
p_mards 1,365 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 The system is a tried and tested success, albeit with limitations, but what tactics in any area doesn't have limitations?. We hit a blip but it doesn't mean we should panic and switch to a new system. We've made some quality signings so when we bed them in, and rediscover the togetherness that we've had for large spells under Karanka, we will hit form again and be a better team than we were before the blip as we weren't performing particularly well yet were grinding out results. Link to post Share on other sites
ManBearPig 1,853 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Instead of worrying about not having Ayala, Friend, Clayton and Gibson, why dont we make sure that the other team has to worry about Rhodes, Downing, Ramirez, Adomah, Stuani etc? We have such a good list of attacking players, yet our first thought is our defence. Change the mentality and go and batter teams from the off. Let THEM worry about stopping us rather than vice versa. Link to post Share on other sites
Snowblind 1,734 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 I don't think we need to change the system. We need to change the approach play to combat the fact that teams are packing the midfield in order to stifle our build up play. Simply playing 4-4-2 does't eradicate that. Oppositions packing the midfield means that the more advanced 3 are forced to drop deeper to support the holding mids and receive the ball in deeper positions just so we can actually keep possession. The difficulty then is obvious - the striker is left isolated. This isn't a difficulty only the Boro face - teams have done it for years against top level Premiership teams. It's part and parcel of being considered top dogs in any division. The key for me is the fluidity, not necessarily an entire change of system. Recently we seem to have lost the fluidity of movement and interchanging of positions from the three behind the striker. Add to that the fact Stuani is still finding his feet after his return, Ramirez is still bedding in, you're never quite sure which Albert is going to turn up anymore and Downing is going through a beige patch and that's where the problem lies. I do hope this highlights to all of those who were calling for only one holding mid earlier in the season just why that would be suicide. Imagine how the last few games would've gone with teams packing the midfield and just one solo holding mid to try and do the clean up job... Link to post Share on other sites
BillyWoofs_shinpad 1,884 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Beige, Snowblind? I'd say the boy was positively mauve. :) Link to post Share on other sites
Snowblind 1,734 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Beige, Snowblind? I'd say the boy was positively mauve. :) My wife brought back a tester pot from B&Q last week... It was called something mental like "Pony Fluff" and was bright pink... That's the perfect colour for De Laet's vibrant form ;) Link to post Share on other sites
"KM" 1,656 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Even if it is 4231 we stick with I'd still like to see that team I suggested above, Adomah and Nugent in for Stuani and Downing. Ramirez keeps his place. Link to post Share on other sites
Borodane 6,301 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Good post Snowblind. Our problem isn't the way we line up it's rather that teams play with 8-9 men in their own half as soon as we have the ball. No matter how hard we line up we will always be out numbered as soon as we cross the half way line. A point against us is a good point for any team in this division. We may have had a blip for the past 5 games yet we have had three draws with two of them coming from losing positions. We now have 7 games in the next 25 days so we have every opportunity to get back into our groove instead of all these mini breaks. I firmly believe that our new attack will start to click and we will be the team to open the scoring and thus opening up the games. Link to post Share on other sites
BillyWoofs_shinpad 1,884 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 If Friend is back in action, I would imagine that AK will have us lined up like this: ----------------Dimi--------------- Nsue---Ayala--De Laet---Friend ------Leadbitter---De Sart------ Stuani----Ramirez----Downing --------------Rhodes--------------- Link to post Share on other sites
Borodane 6,301 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Wonder if Fry will travel with the youth team or stay home. Has there been any info on that? Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 2,492 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Not sure. If he travelled to Spain with the first team that probably gives us our answer. Link to post Share on other sites
pikerman 1,121 Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 If Friend is back in action, I would imagine that AK will have us lined up like this: ----------------Dimi--------------- Nsue---Ayala--De Laet---Friend ------Leadbitter---De Sart------ Stuani----Ramirez----Downing --------------Rhodes--------------- Do you think that is the end of Forshaw then ? Link to post Share on other sites
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