Boro v Birmingham (A) 2-2

[Rioch's Braves 711]

The one thing our players have done in the past weeks is battle right till the very end, we've scored last minute goals because rather than let our heads drop we've kept going for it and got our just rewards.

 

The Birmingham game when it went 2-2 we went straight at them and had a god goal disallowed, that's not a team that's lacking in confidence that's a team that's not prepared to lay down and die.

[Guest Changing Times]

 

 

Players don't win because of cheering, nor lose because of a lack of it. Spot on. It's also not what I said. It's nowhere near as simple as that.

 

To say it doesn't ever have an effect on a game continues to be laughable. After all, you said you barely leave a game with any voice remaining. If it has zero effect, what do you actually do it for? Curious what your motivations are if not to try and lift the players.

 

I can't say it bothers me what you find laughable to be honest.  I know it wasn't what you said but you clearly understand my point because you've made it yourself.  My motivation as you put it is that I'm part of the event and it's an emotional response to what's happening out on the field. I don't think me shouting or not shouting would influence the game in any way.  I shout at the telly when I'm watching from home and I'm probably not the only one that does that - do you think it's because I believe they can hear me? :)

 

If it effects the game then why didn't we beat Ipswich? Why has our home record been so good this season in a ground that hasn't had an especially good atmosphere quite a lot of the time?  Why is it that we were so flat against Sheff Wed in front of one of our biggest gates and probably best atmospheres but completely different a week later against Derby again in front of one of our biggest gates and best atmospheres?  Why did we lose to Leeds last season but beat them this season in a similar situation re crowd size but arguably a flatter atmosphere this season despite the fact that we won?  We had a chance to go 4 points clear last season didn't we but we blew it and the atmosphere generated made no difference at all.

[Guest Changing Times]

A bouncing atmosphere won't simply make the players play well, if it did then we'd have been better off spending the £9m we spent on Rhodes paying 9000 people a grand a piece to fill the ground up each week and make loads of noise.

 

Good lord, I feel like banging my head against a brick wall.

 

As I said:

 

Players don't win because of cheering, nor lose because of a lack of it. Spot on. It's also not what I said. It's nowhere near as simple as that.

 

I do not understand what you're getting at, especially when you've not answered the question I actually asked. Why do you cheer if not to try and inspire a better performance? You seem to be making it very clear that you think that it means nothing what happens in the stands, so why even bother?

 

Maybe you can wait until I actually reply to you as I have now done in my previous post mate?

[Borodane 6,294]

CT, you must be the only person in the world who doesn't think the crowd have any influence on the players' performances. It is certainly one of the explanations as to why the home team is statistically the better team. Otherwise it should even itself out over the season. Playing in front of your own fans breeds confidence, if the fans are behind you mind, and gives those extra few percentages while taking away some from the opposition. It would be inhumane not to be affected by 30.000 people either backing you or being on your back.

[Will 2,958]

 

 

Players don't win because of cheering, nor lose because of a lack of it. Spot on. It's also not what I said. It's nowhere near as simple as that.

 

To say it doesn't ever have an effect on a game continues to be laughable. After all, you said you barely leave a game with any voice remaining. If it has zero effect, what do you actually do it for? Curious what your motivations are if not to try and lift the players.

 

I can't say it bothers me what you find laughable to be honest.  I know it wasn't what you said but you clearly understand my point because you've made it yourself.  My motivation as you put it is that I'm part of the event and it's an emotional response to what's happening out on the field. I don't think me shouting or not shouting would influence the game in any way.  I shout at the telly when I'm watching from home and I'm probably not the only one that does that - do you think it's because I believe they can hear me? :)

 

If it effects the game then why didn't we beat Ipswich? Why has our home record been so good this season in a ground that hasn't had an especially good atmosphere quite a lot of the time?  Why is it that we were so flat against Sheff Wed in front of one of our biggest gates and probably best atmospheres but completely different a week later against Derby again in front of one of our biggest gates and best atmospheres?  Why did we lose to Leeds last season but beat them this season in a similar situation re crowd size but arguably a flatter atmosphere this season despite the fact that we won?  We had a chance to go 4 points clear last season didn't we but we blew it and the atmosphere generated made no difference at all.

 

So you're rejecting the opinions of virtually every professional/former footballer I've ever seen talk about this subject in favour of pointing out individual games that we didn't win/perform in front of big crowds. You must be on a wind up?

[Guest Changing Times]

CT, you must be the only person in the world who doesn't think the crowd have any influence on the players' performances. It is certainly one of the explanations as to why the home team is statistically the better team. Otherwise it should even itself out over the season. Playing in front of your own fans breeds confidence, if the fans are behind you mind, and gives those extra few percentages while taking away some from the opposition. It would be inhumane not to be affected by 30.000 people either backing you or being on your back.

 

I'll once again copy what I wrote originally so that you and everyone else can read it and understand what I'm saying:

 

'...I'd be more concerned with the players rather than Boro fans as like it or not we will have very little say in this.  Either we'll show up next week or we won't.  The fans will have nowt to do with it really, it's all on the players and staff.'

 

So to put it simply, we can generate the best atmosphere the ground has ever seen next weekend but if the players freeze or don't show up then it won't make the slightest bit of difference.  If the players show up, even if the fans are nervy and tense, then it won't suddenly stop the players from playing well. If they are up for it they'll be up for it regardless of us or not up for it regardless of us.  If the pressure gets to them then there is nothing we can do.

[Brunners 7,981]

Mate when a crowd is nervy that filters down into the players as well; I don't know how you can disagree with that.

 

As Will says, nearly ever footballer/ex footballer/athlete in general I've ever seen talk about it has admitted the crowd really does make a difference.

[Guest Changing Times]

So you're rejecting the opinions of virtually every professional/former footballer I've ever seen talk about this subject in favour of pointing out individual games that we didn't win/perform in front of big crowds. You must be on a wind up?

 

Have you ever heard one talk about a poor atmosphere following a win or a great one following a comfortable defeat?  It's always the other way around.  So is it actually a factor or is it only a by product of what is actually happening i.e. a poor atmosphere associated with losses and better ones associated with wins and great ones associated with wins in big games?  

 

When teams are losing a lot the poor atmosphere will always get a mention and likewise when teams have a big win and the place is bouncing.  But when it's the opposite way around then nobody mentions it because it's now not deemed to be a factor?  A team winning with a fairly poor atmosphere is doing it despite it but a team losing with one says that it's partly to blame.   A team winning with a great atmosphere mentions how great it was but losing with one and what, we should have done a lot better because the atmosphere was great?  I don't think we see that much do we? You don't think that maybe there are reasons for what and when footballers say things?

[Guest Changing Times]

Mate when a crowd is nervy that filters down into the players as well; I don't know how you can disagree with that.

 

As Will says, nearly ever footballer/ex footballer/athlete in general I've ever seen talk about it has admitted the crowd really does make a difference.

 

Tbh I think they use it as an excuse mate because football as an industry is full of excuses.

 

But now I'll ask a straight forward question to anyone interested.  If the players freeze next weekend will the atmosphere make the slightest bit of difference? 

 

At the end of the day this is all I said in my original post that if they don't show up or they freeze then nothing we do matters so I'm more concerned with what they do than what we do.  I don't think there's anything unreasonable about that.

[Will 2,958]

So you're rejecting the opinions of virtually every professional/former footballer I've ever seen talk about this subject in favour of pointing out individual games that we didn't win/perform in front of big crowds. You must be on a wind up?

 

Have you ever heard one talk about a poor atmosphere following a win or a great one following a comfortable defeat?  It's always the other way around.  So is it actually a factor or is it only a by product of what is actually happening i.e. a poor atmosphere associated with losses and better ones associated with wins and great ones associated with wins in big games?  

 

When teams are losing a lot the poor atmosphere will always get a mention and likewise when teams have a big win and the place is bouncing.  But when it's the opposite way around then nobody mentions it because it's now not deemed to be a factor?  A team winning with a fairly poor atmosphere is doing it despite it but a team losing with one says that it's partly to blame.   A team winning with a great atmosphere mentions how great it was but losing with one and what, we should have done a lot better because the atmosphere was great?  I don't think we see that much do we? You don't think that maybe there are reasons for what and when footballers say things?

 

A good atmosphere doesn't guarantee anything, it isn't the be all and end all. Teams can lose with a fantastic backing from their fans, and equally teams can win with their own fans getting right on their backs. Nobody is saying that the fans will make us win next week, but I strongly believe that we can have an influence to a degree. If the players crack next week then we wont be promoted, regardless of the atmosphere, but don't you think that a good atmosphere, like the atmosphere at the playoff semi final last season, could help the players' mood and help to stop them from bottling it?

[Borodane 6,294]

I'll give you that if every player freezes completely then there is probably not much the crowd can do but if one or two is below par or the team finds it a bit tough to get going then a good home crowd can help them overcome.

 

A good home crowd can definitely help them find those last important percentages but if they simply decide not to turn up the crowd can't make them play. I think you are painting a too black and white picture. It's not a case of the crowd can/cannot help but more a case of them giving the players the last boost of confidence.

[richmfc 41]

I think if players freeze on the day then yes the crowd can change it round , useually if the players freeze the crowd get on there backs so it doesn't happen. But one good tackle or the crowd really getting behind them can lift a team

[Erimus 63 481]

I think if players freeze on the day then yes the crowd can change it round ,  useually if the players freeze the crowd get on there backs so it doesn't happen.  But one good tackle or the crowd really getting behind them can lift a team

 

Dear God!... There is more to winning a match than the crowd cheering  :rolleyes:

[Will 2,958]

I think if players freeze on the day then yes the crowd can change it round ,  useually if the players freeze the crowd get on there backs so it doesn't happen.  But one good tackle or the crowd really getting behind them can lift a team

 

Dear God!... There is more to winning a match than the crowd cheering  :rolleyes:

 

Dear God! That's not what Rich said... :rolleyes:

[richmfc 41]

I think if players freeze on the day then yes the crowd can change it round ,  useually if the players freeze the crowd get on there backs so it doesn't happen.  But one good tackle or the crowd really getting behind them can lift a team

 

Dear God!... There is more to winning a match than the crowd cheering  :rolleyes:

 

Dear God! That's not what Rich said... :rolleyes:

 

Thanks will ... The crowd don't always make a difference in the same way subs don't always make a difference but the crowd play a part and sometimes a big part..if not why not stay at home and watch on the telly