wilsoncgp 9,283 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I'm of the opinion that Dimi is a league 1 standard keeper (which his ~20 year career seems to show) who has played out of his skin for us. And therein lies that stigma that I was talking about. He is still seen as that 4th choice keeper brought in seemingly out of nothing with a background of only playing in teams at a lower level. But that's how he was seen 2 years ago. Do these last 2 years mean nothing? Shouldn't we be simply judging him on how he has performed for us rather than holding his entire career against him? After the average *** we've gone through with keepers like Jones, Turnbull, Coyne, etc. Dimi has been a level above them all with some of the saves he's pulled off. The only keeper who has come close to that for us has been Given in his short spell here. Let's not forget Carl Ikeme I did think about Ikeme, he definitely had a pretty good 10 games with us. He's been dog dirt for Wolves when I've seen them play, mind. Link to post Share on other sites
Rioch's Braves 711 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league Well no, because that's not the sole argument for replacing Dimi. He's viewed by several posters on here as a weak link in our squad - players like Friend, Clayton, Ayala, etc. none of who(m?) have played at the top level, as strong areas. I'm of the opinion that Dimi is a league 1 standard keeper (which his ~20 year career seems to show) who has played out of his skin for us. Has he been bad this season - no. There's been mistakes but by and large he has performed. Should he be our goalie in the Premier League - in my opinion no. There's glaring weaknesses in his game that will be exploited as more often than not we'll be the team under the cosh. If Dimi was a league 1 standard keeper he wouldn't have kept goal for a promotion chasing team that has been near top of the championship for the last 2 seasons, he would have been playing league 1 football, so your argument doesn't stack up. Link to post Share on other sites
MMC 1,000 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I'm of the opinion that Dimi is a league 1 standard keeper (which his ~20 year career seems to show) who has played out of his skin for us. And therein lies that stigma that I was talking about. He is still seen as that 4th choice keeper brought in seemingly out of nothing with a background of only playing in teams at a lower level. But that's how he was seen 2 years ago. Do these last 2 years mean nothing? Shouldn't we be simply judging him on how he has performed for us rather than holding his entire career against him? After the average *** we've gone through with keepers like Jones, Turnbull, Coyne, etc. Dimi has been a level above them all with some of the saves he's pulled off. The only keeper who has come close to that for us has been Given in his short spell here. These last 2 years mean plenty. Do the 18 beforehand just get discounted in favour of that though? Link to post Share on other sites
Betamaxman 14 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 These last 2 years mean plenty. Do the 18 beforehand just get discounted in favour of that though? What a daft question. The 18 years before that are what have lead Dimi to be a great keeper. That's like being in line for a promotion at work, and your boss saying 'You are now good enough, but I'm afraid there's no promotion because you weren't good enough in all the years before this'. I think it's called development. Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 2,492 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Link to post Share on other sites
Rioch's Braves 711 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Link to post Share on other sites
jamesp 125 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Yes but Clayton and Friend have had fantastic seasons and look well capable of stepping up, thats not the case with Dimi Link to post Share on other sites
Brunners 7,982 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Yes but Clayton and Friend have had fantastic seasons and look well capable of stepping up, thats not the case with Dimi "in your opinion" Stop stating opinions as facts. Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
Barticus 29 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I always though opinion is what you think is fact, otherwise you wouldn't have an opinion, surely a forum is to share your opinions and the fact that we don't have the same views makes the forum work Link to post Share on other sites
Brunners 7,982 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I always though opinion is what you think is fact, otherwise you wouldn't have an opinion, surely a forum is to share your opinions and the fact that we don't have the same views makes the forum work He presents his opinions as if they're categorical facts though. He can believe Dimi isn't good enough all he wants. He can't go around saying stuff like "look well capable of stepping up, thats not the case with Dimi" and "So when the inevitable happens next season if we give him a chance at being #1 and he starts to cost us games what do we do then?" and not expect people to call him out on it. Link to post Share on other sites
Rioch's Braves 711 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Yes but Clayton and Friend have had fantastic seasons and look well capable of stepping up, thats not the case with Dimi Some on here were calling for Friend to be dropped after he came back from injury in favour of De Laet. Link to post Share on other sites
TAPOUT 361 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 I think Dimi will start as number 1 next year. Karanka does show loyalty to those who deliver and he has been a good keeper for us. Yes he has made mistakes but those are accentuated in his position. I think Karanka will buy another goalkeeper however, but not sure what he will be looking for. The Southend lad has a good reputation so he may look at that type who could potentially deliver now and improve as well or go for experience. Karanka doesn't show sentiment as demonstrated when Mejias was dropped so I think he will have a handle on the situation. Link to post Share on other sites
jamesp 125 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Yes but Clayton and Friend have had fantastic seasons and look well capable of stepping up, thats not the case with Dimi "in your opinion" Stop stating opinions as facts. Thanks. In which part of that did I state my opinion as a fact? Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 2,492 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league No, that would only be the case if Clayton and Friend were 33/34 (the outfield equivalent of Dimi's age). Besides, Friend has played in the PL, and Clayton has been part of a Premier League squad. Dimi hasn't. I say this as a big fan of Dimi, but those are the facts. Friend had a couple of games for Wolves,and being part of a PL squad is hardly PL experience, Downing's what you call PL experience, talk about clutching at straws. Not really. Just making the point that the two players that rich mentioned have, at some point in their 10 year or so careers, have been considered worthy of at least competing for a spot in a premier league side. Dimi has never had this, despite playing twice as long. Link to post Share on other sites
richmfc 41 Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Gi Gi Buffoon is 38 and still goalkeeper and captain of Juve, if he was in our squad some on here would have sent him packing because of age, and no I'm not suggesting Dimi is anywhere near Buffoon's keeping abilities ( not many in football are) before anyone jumps in, just making a comparison with regard to age. Age wise, goalkeeping is unique in that its probably the only position on the field where you can play into your 40's at the highest level Shay Given, Brad Friedel being examples. I do sort of agree with you, but I think the point people are making is that in a 20-year career, Dimi has never played at a level as high as the Premier League. Guzan, Buffon etc have all consistently been at the top level, rather than jobbing around lower leagues before finally being asked to make the step up when they're pushing 40. If that argument stands for dimi it should also be true for the rest of our squad ie friend clayton that have never played in the premier league Well no, because that's not the sole argument for replacing Dimi. He's viewed by several posters on here as a weak link in our squad - players like Friend, Clayton, Ayala, etc. none of who(m?) have played at the top level, as strong areas. I'm of the opinion that Dimi is a league 1 standard keeper (which his ~20 year career seems to show) who has played out of his skin for us. Has he been bad this season - no. There's been mistakes but by and large he has performed. Should he be our goalie in the Premier League - in my opinion no. There's glaring weaknesses in his game that will be exploited as more often than not we'll be the team under the cosh. But it was the main argument for some that dimi hasn't played premier league therefore he isn't good enough. So let's say fry doesn't deserve a chance or adohma. Or nsue or Rhodes or Gibson or any of our youth non of who have played in the premier league Link to post Share on other sites
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