Boro v Crystal Palace (A) 0-1

[Boro 86 517]

The reason we got beat is that we didn't have anything that compared to a Zaha or even a Benteke up front. It is plain for everyone to see (and I am certain AK sees this) that our front 4 means we have no option but to play a defence first team. On saturday I watched the game and we were indeed poor in the first half and for all our bluster in the second half didn't have the quality to unlock what became a ragged Palace at times.

 

Was it bad tactics that got us beat .. No.. it was just that we weren't good enough on the day.

 

Saturday showed us why Downing isn't a wing back , why Forshaw isn't the answer in the middle , why Ramirez isn't missed at Southampton or Hull! I could go on but the fact is that these are still the best we have for now and they will have to dust themselves off and go again at Stoke.

[Humpty 3,261]

"We don't have anyone like Benteke?"

 

Benteke has played 30 international games and scored 9.

Negredo has played 21 international games and scored 10.

 

Do Palace have a Gibson or a Valdes? Nope. etc. etc.

 

We didn't even play to our own strengths on Saturday so i don't know how you can put it down to anything else other our tactics.

[Red Rocket 244]

It's been mentioned by a couple of people but we still continue to have the same problem that we've had for years, midfield is too static. They stand around waiting for the ball to come to them, rather then trying to create space for themselves.

 

Negredo went off in a tactical change but the lad's body language said it all. He isn't going to score because he doesn't get the service. Midfield is and always has been our issue, not how many strikers we play. Gestede worked his socks off to try and create something, I thought he played well and tried hard but it was never gonna be enough.

 

The lack of chances is now starting to make us snatch at them when we do get them because the strikers know it's gonna be other bloody twenty minutes (if they're lucky) before they get another one.

 

I don't agree the lads didn't try. There are so many things that can be criticised in that game but it's unfair to say that. They tried, they just didn't have a clue what to do.

[Downsouth 6,327]

It's been mentioned by a couple of people but we still continue to have the same problem that we've had for years, midfield is too static. They stand around waiting for the ball to come to them, rather then trying to create space for themselves.

 

Negredo went off in a tactical change but the lad's body language said it all. He isn't going to score because he doesn't get the service. Midfield is and always has been our issue, not how many strikers we play. Gestede worked his socks off to try and create something, I thought he played well and tried hard but it was never gonna be enough.

 

The lack of chances is now starting to make us snatch at them when we do get them because the strikers know it's gonna be other bloody twenty minutes (if they're lucky) before they get another one.

 

I don't agree the lads didn't try. There are so many things that can be criticised in that game but it's unfair to say that. They tried, they just didn't have a clue what to do.

 

Good post Jen and sums up our situation perfectly and you are right it has been this way for what seems ages.

 

What I do not understand is why there does not appear to be any "from the top" influence on matters. Many have mentioned that SG is a Boro supporter first and foremost so he has to see the same as every pundit who attends games or watches illegal streams.

 

One man only does not seem to think the same as the rest of us and sadly he is the one who carries everyones hopes on his shoulders.

 

I really do not believe that in the grand scheme of things that there are any contented Boro fans :shy:

[Betamaxman 14]

It's been mentioned by a couple of people but we still continue to have the same problem that we've had for years, midfield is too static. They stand around waiting for the ball to come to them, rather then trying to create space for themselves.

 

Negredo went off in a tactical change but the lad's body language said it all. He isn't going to score because he doesn't get the service. Midfield is and always has been our issue, not how many strikers we play. Gestede worked his socks off to try and create something, I thought he played well and tried hard but it was never gonna be enough.

 

The lack of chances is now starting to make us snatch at them when we do get them because the strikers know it's gonna be other bloody twenty minutes (if they're lucky) before they get another one.

 

I don't agree the lads didn't try. There are so many things that can be criticised in that game but it's unfair to say that. They tried, they just didn't have a clue what to do.

 

^^^These things.

 

I thought Gestede did really well when he came on. He was a beast, and won pretty much every aerial ball that was punted forwards. (We kind of resorted to that in the end). The trouble is, as we know that there's not much support for it, although it did almost lead to a couple of chances.

 

As you say, we don't have enough movement in the middle of the park / going forwards. However, like I said in a previous post, because the defensive side of play is being so coached in to the players, I think it's stifling our attacking play.

 

I agree that the players tried, but I think we had certain players in certain positions who didn't really know what they were doing, or couldn't really do it. As a result they looked a bit lost.

[Guest Changing Times]

I was going to respond with a like-for-like rant but I honestly don't see the point. You've decided you're right and that's all that matters.

 

You really don't see things my way and that's clear enough now. I won't change my mind on it either. I said what I saw and we both have that right. I watched the game and saw a lack of drive and passion. You're saying that's not how it is but that's how I saw it so it really doesn't matter. My opinion is based on what I saw. That system, those players, could have won that game had they thrown themselves at it and proved that they understood the meaning of the game. You didn't need to tell Zaha, Puncheon, Townsend, Benteke etc. how important it was, they showed it on the pitch. In my opinion, we didn't respond in kind and were beaten by a poor team through simply showing more intention to get the points.

 

It wasn't a rant, it was a fairly detailed explanation of my opinion.  The first paragraph was written for emphasis as I continue to be amazed that people take what Karanka says as gospel.

 

Yes I've decided I'm right whatever that means.  If I put an opinion on here it's because I believe it to be true.  You're now the second person who has said something along those lines as though you're trying to make me look bad for believing in my own opinion.  Firstly, I'm more than capable of making me look bad all by myself. Secondly, if I write something it's entirely because I believe I'm right otherwise I wouldn't waste my or anyone else's time.  Unless you and richmfc are routinely posting stuff you don't believe to be right then you're doing exactly the same.  In fact you say quite clearly that you won't change your mind so why even make that comment to me?

 

It's easy to blame lack of effort or lack of passion.  You hear it all the time and usually it's codswallop. Whatever our failings are or might be, lack of effort isn't one of them.  Even on the odd occasion that I've felt an individual hasn't been putting 100% in (Negredo a couple of times), generally the rest of them are doing their best.  The players looked lost in the first half and that doesn't suggest a lack of effort to me. That suggests a team who are unsure what they are supposed to be doing and that comes from the tactics/gameplan/strategy.

[BoroDave4 1,025]

I was going to respond with a like-for-like rant but I honestly don't see the point. You've decided you're right and that's all that matters.

 

You really don't see things my way and that's clear enough now. I won't change my mind on it either. I said what I saw and we both have that right. I watched the game and saw a lack of drive and passion. You're saying that's not how it is but that's how I saw it so it really doesn't matter. My opinion is based on what I saw. That system, those players, could have won that game had they thrown themselves at it and proved that they understood the meaning of the game. You didn't need to tell Zaha, Puncheon, Townsend, Benteke etc. how important it was, they showed it on the pitch. In my opinion, we didn't respond in kind and were beaten by a poor team through simply showing more intention to get the points.

 

It wasn't a rant, it was a fairly detailed explanation of my opinion.  The first paragraph was written for emphasis as I continue to be amazed that people take what Karanka says as gospel.

 

Yes I've decided I'm right whatever that means.  If I put an opinion on here it's because I believe it to be true.  You're now the second person who has said something along those lines as though you're trying to make me look bad for believing in my own opinion.  Firstly, I'm more than capable of making me look bad all by myself. Secondly, if I write something it's entirely because I believe I'm right otherwise I wouldn't waste my or anyone else's time.  Unless you and richmfc are routinely posting stuff you don't believe to be right then you're doing exactly the same.  In fact you say quite clearly that you won't change your mind so why even make that comment to me?

 

It's easy to blame lack of effort or lack of passion.  You hear it all the time and usually it's codswallop. Whatever our failings are or might be, lack of effort isn't one of them.  Even on the odd occasion that I've felt an individual hasn't been putting 100% in (Negredo a couple of times), generally the rest of them are doing their best.  The players looked lost in the first half and that doesn't suggest a lack of effort to me. That suggests a team who are unsure what they are supposed to be doing and that comes from the tactics/gameplan/strategy.

 

We sit on two opposite sides of the fence, so I am not going to broach a bunch of things. The one thing I might like to point out though is that from what I have seen people point out (and myself included) is that there seemed to be a lack if fight and determination on Saturday - not a lack of effort.

 

I can agree that there was certainly effort Saturday. It takes a lot of work and discipline to play in our way. But what I didn't see was a single player showing real heart and fight for the team. And that is what really irked me Saturday more than anything else.

[Red Rocket 244]

I don't really understand how effort and 'heart and fight' are two separate things. We either tried or we didn't.

[BoroDave4 1,025]

I don't really understand how effort and 'heart and fight' are two separate things. We either tried or we didn't.

 

Forshaw puts in effort, Leadbitter puts in heart and fight and determination. I put effort into cooking dinner, I put heart and fight into my projects. When my dinner turns out to be tasteless I go "ah thats a bit naff, maybe I should have added paprika?" When my projects aren't going well I get angry or upset, I am consumed as to how I can make it work or improve it.

 

That's the best description I can give of my interpretation.

[juninho9 35]

There's a thread on fmttm asking whether the people at the game thought there was a lack of effort on Saturday.

 

It was a pretty unanimous no.

 

I think Ramirez was the only one who at times showed a lack of effort. So many times he went down and just couldn't be bothered to get back up. There was a throw in to Palace right by us and he didn't concentrate and mark his man. Townsend must've loved Saturday; he had so much time on the ball and was given ample opportunities to cross it in.

[Boro 86 517]

I think all this fight or no fight talk is rubbish myself. The simple fact (ok as I see it anyway) is that some players are not up to the task. Very good in the champo but over a long season getting found out in the prem. AK knows that , Stevie G knows that and we know it but getting the players in to change that is not easy.

 

If you look at our players and who would probably get in a best of the bottom 7 teams currently I suspect only Valdes and Gibson would feature. The fact we are still hanging on in there tells me we have (mainly) good honest pros in our squad who are performing at their best and if we are still a premiership team in a few years that they will likely as not all have been replaced.

[Humpty 3,261]

How many Burnley players do you think would get in a best of the bottom 7? Michael Keane maybe?

[gephind 7]

I think all this fight or no fight talk is rubbish myself. The simple fact (ok as I see it anyway) is that some players are not up to the task. Very good in the champo but over a long season getting found out in the prem. AK knows that , Stevie G knows that and we know it but getting the players in to change that is not easy.

 

If you look at our players and who would probably get in a best of the bottom 7 teams currently I suspect only Valdes and Gibson would feature. The fact we are still hanging on in there tells me we have (mainly) good honest pros in our squad who are performing at their best and if we are still a premiership team in a few years that they will likely as not all have been replaced.

 

+1 Sir.

[gephind 7]

It's been mentioned by a couple of people but we still continue to have the same problem that we've had for years, midfield is too static. They stand around waiting for the ball to come to them, rather then trying to create space for themselves.

 

Negredo went off in a tactical change but the lad's body language said it all. He isn't going to score because he doesn't get the service. Midfield is and always has been our issue, not how many strikers we play. Gestede worked his socks off to try and create something, I thought he played well and tried hard but it was never gonna be enough.

 

The lack of chances is now starting to make us snatch at them when we do get them because the strikers know it's gonna be other bloody twenty minutes (if they're lucky) before they get another one.

 

I don't agree the lads didn't try. There are so many things that can be criticised in that game but it's unfair to say that. They tried, they just didn't have a clue what to do.

I agree with you It just seems that we either on given days are good at breaking up play in midfield or as this game showed seem to be just second best. When we do get to put some attacking passes and moves together its very infrequent with often no end product.

[richmfc 41]

I was going to respond with a like-for-like rant but I honestly don't see the point. You've decided you're right and that's all that matters.

 

You really don't see things my way and that's clear enough now. I won't change my mind on it either. I said what I saw and we both have that right. I watched the game and saw a lack of drive and passion. You're saying that's not how it is but that's how I saw it so it really doesn't matter. My opinion is based on what I saw. That system, those players, could have won that game had they thrown themselves at it and proved that they understood the meaning of the game. You didn't need to tell Zaha, Puncheon, Townsend, Benteke etc. how important it was, they showed it on the pitch. In my opinion, we didn't respond in kind and were beaten by a poor team through simply showing more intention to get the points.

 

It wasn't a rant, it was a fairly detailed explanation of my opinion.  The first paragraph was written for emphasis as I continue to be amazed that people take what Karanka says as gospel.

 

Yes I've decided I'm right whatever that means.  If I put an opinion on here it's because I believe it to be true.  You're now the second person who has said something along those lines as though you're trying to make me look bad for believing in my own opinion.  Firstly, I'm more than capable of making me look bad all by myself. Secondly, if I write something it's entirely because I believe I'm right otherwise I wouldn't waste my or anyone else's time.  Unless you and richmfc are routinely posting stuff you don't believe to be right then you're doing exactly the same.  In fact you say quite clearly that you won't change your mind so why even make that comment to me?

 

It's easy to blame lack of effort or lack of passion.  You hear it all the time and usually it's codswallop. Whatever our failings are or might be, lack of effort isn't one of them.  Even on the odd occasion that I've felt an individual hasn't been putting 100% in (Negredo a couple of times), generally the rest of them are doing their best.  The players looked lost in the first half and that doesn't suggest a lack of effort to me. That suggests a team who are unsure what they are supposed to be doing and that comes from the tactics/gameplan/strategy.

 

What have I done now :)