The need for an away ticket loyalty system

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

RSS I have already given an explanation for why a season ticket is a commitment to the club whereas away game support is not. A season ticket is paid fully before the start of the season, regardless of if you turn up to the games you've still paid for them. Going away from home is no commitment at all, people pick and choose the games they can and want to do and generally they do them. I've also mentioned but you seemingly ignored that away ticket revenue is unimportant to the club, having a good travelling support is nice but it makes no real difference to our club. To try and equate away day support and season ticket owners is silly, one is financially invested in the club and stumped up in excess of £400 in advance to get a season ticket, in the balance book of the club an away day fan is quite literally nothing.

I think you struggle with the difference between reality and fantasy - you state your opinion as if it were absolute fact, all you are stating is your opinion - for a start season ticket holders are usually the ones who get the away day tickets so how are they then separate to compare? 

I mean the whole thread is about certain season ticket holders not getting a ticket for villa away isn't it?

Where was the amount of money going into the club suddenly relevant?

You have stated what the club thinks and values most from fans - where do you get this info from? 

Regardless of anyones thoughts, one persons commitment is different to another depending on circumstances. I am of the opinion that the system is fine as it is, I don't recognize one fan being a better fan than another - thats the somewhat spoilt brat / childish view held by  a few on here and elsewhere.

As for away fans not making a commitment - heres an example;-

Myself and some old mates are going to try to go to every away match next season, so we can do it fairly, we will be paying up front for the mini bus for the season (so its definitely booked for each game) and half the cost of the tickets up front so if people pull out it doesn't ruin it for everyone else and shows we are committed  - I can't be bothered going into how we know we will get tickets etc. lets just say we have been proactive rather than whining on internet forums. So - is that a commitment to following my club as a fan - or doesn't it count because the money doesn't go into the club?

By the way I didn't ignore one of your points - I actually didn't read it - I find your posts argumentative and boring with very little else to offer other than being antagonistic and never wrong - funny as I've noticed you've failed to respond to counter posts I've made too - mind I don't remember being bothered enough to bring it up.

Randy, please read my long post arguing for a points system. It's not that I think fans going to away games are better fans. It's that the club have already ascribed value to season ticket holders as they have priority for away tickets. So if the commitment of having a season ticket is recognised by the club, surely the commitment of going to away matches should also be proportionally recognised.

[Will 2,958]

RSS I have already given an explanation for why a season ticket is a commitment to the club whereas away game support is not. A season ticket is paid fully before the start of the season, regardless of if you turn up to the games you've still paid for them. Going away from home is no commitment at all, people pick and choose the games they can and want to do and generally they do them. I've also mentioned but you seemingly ignored that away ticket revenue is unimportant to the club, having a good travelling support is nice but it makes no real difference to our club. To try and equate away day support and season ticket owners is silly, one is financially invested in the club and stumped up in excess of £400 in advance to get a season ticket, in the balance book of the club an away day fan is quite literally nothing.

I think you struggle with the difference between reality and fantasy - you state your opinion as if it were absolute fact, all you are stating is your opinion - for a start season ticket holders are usually the ones who get the away day tickets so how are they then separate to compare? 

I mean the whole thread is about certain season ticket holders not getting a ticket for villa away isn't it?

Where was the amount of money going into the club suddenly relevant?

You have stated what the club thinks and values most from fans - where do you get this info from? 

Regardless of anyones thoughts, one persons commitment is different to another depending on circumstances. I am of the opinion that the system is fine as it is, I don't recognize one fan being a better fan than another - thats the somewhat spoilt brat / childish view held by  a few on here and elsewhere.

As for away fans not making a commitment - heres an example;-

Myself and some old mates are going to try to go to every away match next season, so we can do it fairly, we will be paying up front for the mini bus for the season (so its definitely booked for each game) and half the cost of the tickets up front so if people pull out it doesn't ruin it for everyone else and shows we are committed  - I can't be bothered going into how we know we will get tickets etc. lets just say we have been proactive rather than whining on internet forums. So - is that a commitment to following my club as a fan - or doesn't it count because the money doesn't go into the club?

By the way I didn't ignore one of your points - I actually didn't read it - I find your posts argumentative and boring with very little else to offer other than being antagonistic and never wrong - funny as I've noticed you've failed to respond to counter posts I've made too - mind I don't remember being bothered enough to bring it up.

 

1 - I wasn't responding to you. My post was directed at RSS or RealSlimSladey. I'm not surprised you missed this as you seem to just be looking for a reason for an argument with me at the moment.

 

2 - I didn't state any opinion as facts, I presented facts (facts you may not like to hear, but facts none the less) as facts.

 

3 - no the point of this thread wasn't about season ticket holders missing out as from what he's said RealSlimSladey isn't a season ticket holder.

 

4 - if you don't think the amount of money going into the club from different sections of the fan base influences the clubs decision making then I despair.

 

5 - you seem to actually agree with me, so why get yourself so wound up about it?

 

6 - the commitment you talk about making next season is to your friends and then to you, nothing to do with the club.

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

Okay, you talked me into it;

 

I actually agree with points from both sides (if that’s possible) in a fashion.

 

Many institutions (shops, theme parks, hotels) talk about repeat customers in terms of “loyalty” to engender this idea that being faithful is a good thing (tell that to my wife) and MFC are no different. I agree with CTs point that this “loyalty” isn’t actually loyalty but it’s actually just how you choose to spend your money and doesn’t make a person more betterer or more entitled than any other.

 

But conversely if the club choose to promote the idea that this is “loyalty” then the system should probably reflect that as it already does with the season card holders. Therefore sladey’s suggestions have some credence that away day “loyalty” should have some form of reward.

 

As I stated earlier it doesn’t effect me so I genuinely have nothing to gain either way. Interesting discussion though.

 

Balanced post, there's certainly two sides to the debate. Also big fan of your username hahah

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

RSS I have already given an explanation for why a season ticket is a commitment to the club whereas away game support is not. A season ticket is paid fully before the start of the season, regardless of if you turn up to the games you've still paid for them. Going away from home is no commitment at all, people pick and choose the games they can and want to do and generally they do them. I've also mentioned but you seemingly ignored that away ticket revenue is unimportant to the club, having a good travelling support is nice but it makes no real difference to our club. To try and equate away day support and season ticket owners is silly, one is financially invested in the club and stumped up in excess of £400 in advance to get a season ticket, in the balance book of the club an away day fan is quite literally nothing.

I think you struggle with the difference between reality and fantasy - you state your opinion as if it were absolute fact, all you are stating is your opinion - for a start season ticket holders are usually the ones who get the away day tickets so how are they then separate to compare? 

I mean the whole thread is about certain season ticket holders not getting a ticket for villa away isn't it?

Where was the amount of money going into the club suddenly relevant?

You have stated what the club thinks and values most from fans - where do you get this info from? 

Regardless of anyones thoughts, one persons commitment is different to another depending on circumstances. I am of the opinion that the system is fine as it is, I don't recognize one fan being a better fan than another - thats the somewhat spoilt brat / childish view held by  a few on here and elsewhere.

As for away fans not making a commitment - heres an example;-

Myself and some old mates are going to try to go to every away match next season, so we can do it fairly, we will be paying up front for the mini bus for the season (so its definitely booked for each game) and half the cost of the tickets up front so if people pull out it doesn't ruin it for everyone else and shows we are committed  - I can't be bothered going into how we know we will get tickets etc. lets just say we have been proactive rather than whining on internet forums. So - is that a commitment to following my club as a fan - or doesn't it count because the money doesn't go into the club?

By the way I didn't ignore one of your points - I actually didn't read it - I find your posts argumentative and boring with very little else to offer other than being antagonistic and never wrong - funny as I've noticed you've failed to respond to counter posts I've made too - mind I don't remember being bothered enough to bring it up.

 

1 - I wasn't responding to you. My post was directed at RSS or RealSlimSladey. I'm not surprised you missed this as you seem to just be looking for a reason for an argument with me at the moment.

 

2 - I didn't state any opinion as facts, I presented facts (facts you may not like to hear, but facts none the less) as facts.

 

3 - no the point of this thread wasn't about season ticket holders missing out as from what he's said RealSlimSladey isn't a season ticket holder.

 

4 - if you don't think the amount of money going into the club from different sections of the fan base influences the clubs decision making then I despair.

 

5 - you seem to actually agree with me, so why get yourself so wound up about it?

 

6 - the commitment you talk about making next season is to your friends and then to you, nothing to do with the club.

 

I do have a season ticket!

[Will 2,958]

RSS I have already given an explanation for why a season ticket is a commitment to the club whereas away game support is not. A season ticket is paid fully before the start of the season, regardless of if you turn up to the games you've still paid for them. Going away from home is no commitment at all, people pick and choose the games they can and want to do and generally they do them. I've also mentioned but you seemingly ignored that away ticket revenue is unimportant to the club, having a good travelling support is nice but it makes no real difference to our club. To try and equate away day support and season ticket owners is silly, one is financially invested in the club and stumped up in excess of £400 in advance to get a season ticket, in the balance book of the club an away day fan is quite literally nothing.

I think you struggle with the difference between reality and fantasy - you state your opinion as if it were absolute fact, all you are stating is your opinion - for a start season ticket holders are usually the ones who get the away day tickets so how are they then separate to compare? 

I mean the whole thread is about certain season ticket holders not getting a ticket for villa away isn't it?

Where was the amount of money going into the club suddenly relevant?

You have stated what the club thinks and values most from fans - where do you get this info from? 

Regardless of anyones thoughts, one persons commitment is different to another depending on circumstances. I am of the opinion that the system is fine as it is, I don't recognize one fan being a better fan than another - thats the somewhat spoilt brat / childish view held by  a few on here and elsewhere.

As for away fans not making a commitment - heres an example;-

Myself and some old mates are going to try to go to every away match next season, so we can do it fairly, we will be paying up front for the mini bus for the season (so its definitely booked for each game) and half the cost of the tickets up front so if people pull out it doesn't ruin it for everyone else and shows we are committed  - I can't be bothered going into how we know we will get tickets etc. lets just say we have been proactive rather than whining on internet forums. So - is that a commitment to following my club as a fan - or doesn't it count because the money doesn't go into the club?

By the way I didn't ignore one of your points - I actually didn't read it - I find your posts argumentative and boring with very little else to offer other than being antagonistic and never wrong - funny as I've noticed you've failed to respond to counter posts I've made too - mind I don't remember being bothered enough to bring it up.

 

1 - I wasn't responding to you. My post was directed at RSS or RealSlimSladey. I'm not surprised you missed this as you seem to just be looking for a reason for an argument with me at the moment.

 

2 - I didn't state any opinion as facts, I presented facts (facts you may not like to hear, but facts none the less) as facts.

 

3 - no the point of this thread wasn't about season ticket holders missing out as from what he's said RealSlimSladey isn't a season ticket holder.

 

4 - if you don't think the amount of money going into the club from different sections of the fan base influences the clubs decision making then I despair.

 

5 - you seem to actually agree with me, so why get yourself so wound up about it?

 

6 - the commitment you talk about making next season is to your friends and then to you, nothing to do with the club.

 

I do have a season ticket!

 

My apologies, your comments about them not being ideal for people outside the area led me to believe you didn't have one.

[Downsouth 6,326]

Talk about flogging a dead horse!

 

Sadly and as this situation does not crop up very often I believe nothing will change as far as MFC are concerned, they have tickets to sell and they will do so purely for monitory reasons.

 

Next week at some point the fairness/unfairness of tickets will increase by 10 fold should we get to Wembly

[Randy Sandwich 209]

RSS I have already given an explanation for why a season ticket is a commitment to the club whereas away game support is not. A season ticket is paid fully before the start of the season, regardless of if you turn up to the games you've still paid for them. Going away from home is no commitment at all, people pick and choose the games they can and want to do and generally they do them. I've also mentioned but you seemingly ignored that away ticket revenue is unimportant to the club, having a good travelling support is nice but it makes no real difference to our club. To try and equate away day support and season ticket owners is silly, one is financially invested in the club and stumped up in excess of £400 in advance to get a season ticket, in the balance book of the club an away day fan is quite literally nothing.

I think you struggle with the difference between reality and fantasy - you state your opinion as if it were absolute fact, all you are stating is your opinion - for a start season ticket holders are usually the ones who get the away day tickets so how are they then separate to compare? 

I mean the whole thread is about certain season ticket holders not getting a ticket for villa away isn't it?

Where was the amount of money going into the club suddenly relevant?

You have stated what the club thinks and values most from fans - where do you get this info from? 

Regardless of anyones thoughts, one persons commitment is different to another depending on circumstances. I am of the opinion that the system is fine as it is, I don't recognize one fan being a better fan than another - thats the somewhat spoilt brat / childish view held by  a few on here and elsewhere.

As for away fans not making a commitment - heres an example;-

Myself and some old mates are going to try to go to every away match next season, so we can do it fairly, we will be paying up front for the mini bus for the season (so its definitely booked for each game) and half the cost of the tickets up front so if people pull out it doesn't ruin it for everyone else and shows we are committed  - I can't be bothered going into how we know we will get tickets etc. lets just say we have been proactive rather than whining on internet forums. So - is that a commitment to following my club as a fan - or doesn't it count because the money doesn't go into the club?

By the way I didn't ignore one of your points - I actually didn't read it - I find your posts argumentative and boring with very little else to offer other than being antagonistic and never wrong - funny as I've noticed you've failed to respond to counter posts I've made too - mind I don't remember being bothered enough to bring it up.

 

1 - I wasn't responding to you. My post was directed at RSS or RealSlimSladey. I'm not surprised you missed this as you seem to just be looking for a reason for an argument with me at the moment.

 

2 - I didn't state any opinion as facts, I presented facts (facts you may not like to hear, but facts none the less) as facts.

 

3 - no the point of this thread wasn't about season ticket holders missing out as from what he's said RealSlimSladey isn't a season ticket holder.

 

4 - if you don't think the amount of money going into the club from different sections of the fan base influences the clubs decision making then I despair.

 

5 - you seem to actually agree with me, so why get yourself so wound up about it?

 

6 - the commitment you talk about making next season is to your friends and then to you, nothing to do with the club.

Sorry I thought it was directed at me - which is probably why I didn't get the connections you were making.

I never said anything about what effects the clubs decision making - i was discussing the actual fans commitment to the club - not where the club rates it - I still don't know how you can speak on behalf of the club on which fans they value the most though.

I do agree in point and I'm definitely not wound up - its game day, I've got the day off - all is great.

Lets hope for a great performance for the club and all the fans (good, bad or not so good ;-) ) 

UTB

By the way Will - don't take what I say too seriously, I'm a dry sarcastic *** person and it doesn't always lend itself well to internet forums.

[Changing Times 12,339]

 

In your first long post you argued that personal relationships with the club are irrelevant to the argument. I agreed with that, so I constructed a non-personal argument. All you've really done here is ignore my new argument and refined your first long post. 'I'll try and make this as easy as possible to understand'... As kind and not-at-all patronising as it is, you don't have to try and make things any easier for me. I understood what you were saying the first time, I just think you're for the most part wrong.

 

My restructured argument is essentially this: The club rewarding season ticket holders with away ticket priority is the minimum amount of priority they can allow. Rewarding one form of match day support but not another is unfair. So, the club should proportionally reward both forms of support with priority over away tickets.

 

You claim going to away games is not a form of commitment. Regardless of what you and I think, the club clearly values holding a season ticket as a form of commitment given the priority season ticket holders get over away tickets. If they view and reward season ticket holders as being a commitment, why shouldn't they do the same with going to away matches? The current system's priority method is necessary. It can't be the case that all Boro fans have an equal crack at away tickets due to the issues it would cause. So, we're stuck with some sort of priority system. A points system, as I've argued more extensively in my long post, is the fairest and most nuanced approach out of the priority systems available.

 

I haven't ignored your 'new' argument.  I read every word of it but this new argument as you put it is irrelevant to your opinion.  You are trying to construct a rational argument to justify an opinion you already hold, an opinion that isn't based on this rational argument at all.  Your opinion is based on the things you included in your letter and what was in your letter was that you feel you are more entitled to a ticket to the Villa game than other fans.  That you having a season ticket despite living in London and going to 11 away games this seasons means you should have had priority to get a ticket.  That you deserve some recognition from MFC for the effort that you put into being a Boro fan.  That is your actual argument, whatever else you are coming up with now is a sideshow to your original feelings.

 

My simple example wasn't meant to be patronising although I knew it would come across that way.  I was trying to give an example that was so basic that you would both understand and accept it.  If you can't understand or accept it then the rest of the discussion is pointless because we hold two completely different points of view.

 

The club use priority for away tickets as a marketing tool to sell season tickets, nothing more than that.  If you think the club give a damn who goes to away games then you're mistaken.  The club do this because a guaranteed income stream is generally more favourable than one which isn't guaranteed and can fluctuate greatly.  The club would make more money selling 20,000 match day tickets per game than 20,000 season tickets but there's no guarantee that they'd sell 20,000 tickets each game and that income would be spread out over the course of 9/10 months.  That is the only reason that the club value season ticket holders, it's all about guaranteed revenue and nothing else.  Guaranteed revenue this season, guaranteed revenue next season and beyond.

 

I'm sorry but all of this comes down to entitlement and nothing else.  You feel you were more entitled to get Villa tickets than other people and I don't believe that's the case so we will always be on completely opposite sides of this.  As I've already stated, I don't really understand why people make a big song and dance about going to away games but clearly some feel it marks them out as special in some way?  I just don't get it at all, it seems a bit arrogant to be honest.

[borojod 7]

What about introducing a season ticket for away games, you essentially commit to every away game and the money is taken from your account automatically (similar to man utd cup tickets that ST holders have to purchase).

 

However, as Will as stated, why would the club invest time and money into something that they wont receive any benefits from.

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

What about introducing a season ticket for away games, you essentially commit to every away game and the money is taken from your account automatically (similar to man utd cup tickets that ST holders have to purchase).

 

However, as Will as stated, why would the club invest time and money into something that they wont receive any benefits from.

 

Yeah I think that’s a decent idea, certainly better thought out than the away season ticket the club tried to introduce a couple seasons back which I think was all the money up front (out of interest, did anyone actually buy it?). Villa have your suggested system in place, not sure what their fan feedback on it has been though.

[Duvel 2,446]

What about introducing a season ticket for away games, you essentially commit to every away game and the money is taken from your account automatically (similar to man utd cup tickets that ST holders have to purchase).

 

However, as Will as stated, why would the club invest time and money into something that they wont receive any benefits from.

 

There is one but it isn't advertised by the club, I think we've got about 200 away season ticket holders at the moment.

[RealSlimSladeyy 769]

What about introducing a season ticket for away games, you essentially commit to every away game and the money is taken from your account automatically (similar to man utd cup tickets that ST holders have to purchase).

 

However, as Will as stated, why would the club invest time and money into something that they wont receive any benefits from.

 

There is one but it isn't advertised by the club, I think we've got about 200 away season ticket holders at the moment.

 

Oh my bad since they never mention it I thought they scrapped it, weird that they don’t advertise it...