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Gibson has and always will have had the final say on transfers for a long time. That's not to say the blame for transfers lands entirely at his door but when transfers go wrong, you expect the man to take some action to stop bad transfers from happening or to stop us from being unprepared for certain situations. As it is, we've had the same scouting setup we've had for ages now and the only thing we've done is we've added a PR guy between them and the chairman and nobody with any clout in the transfer decisions has any knowledge of football beyond the experience they have from working in it in their positions as a chairman, CEO, PR, etc.

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Sorry, but I can't agree with this. The vast majority of Boro fans recognise Gibson is a fan first and foremost. He loves the club so much he - with help from others - saved it in 1986, and he's earne

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7 hours ago, Randy Sandwich said:

To be honest I was trying to make sense of your point about wolves. 

You said you were sure Wolves players didn't dream about living in Wolverhampton in response to me saying we've only attracted most of our players over the years with money.  

I'm nut sure if we gave them a happy working environment -  I know people like Paul Merson Struggled, you'd have to ask them. 

 

Merson struggled partly because he was living with Gazza, which was quite possibly the worst idea in the world. I mean honestly, who at the club thought that was a good idea?

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1 minute ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Merson struggled partly because he was living with Gazza, which was quite possibly the worst idea in the world. I mean honestly, who at the club thought that was a good idea?

Wasn't it Robson's idea? Haha

I daren't imagine what they got up to in that house. There is the infamous sleeping tablet story.

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6 minutes ago, DanFromDownSouth said:

Wasn't it Robson's idea? Haha

I daren't imagine what they got up to in that house. There is the infamous sleeping tablet story.

That sounds about right. I know part of Merson's deal was allowing his brother to move up and live with him (all expenses paid for by the club!)

A lot of it is detailed in Merson's book, "How not to be a professional footballer" (He's not exactly complimentary towards us but it's a good read.)

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6 minutes ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

That sounds about right. I know part of Merson's deal was allowing his brother to move up and live with him (all expenses paid for by the club!)

A lot of it is detailed in Merson's book, "How not to be a professional footballer" (He's not exactly complimentary towards us but it's a good read.)

I've not read it before. What type of things does he say about the Boro? Good and bad?

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11 hours ago, Randy Sandwich said:

Ah right, yes I agree then, got my wires crossed - certainly with a similar owner and structure we could attract similar players yes, there are some nice places to live out of town too. 

So are you hoping he's trying to sell the club? 

I'm not particularly arguing for or against Gibson selling the club, I'm just trying to counter the suggestion made that no one would want to buy the club. I don't think we are as unattractive as some people think. 

To be honest I've never wanted Gibson to sell up, I always been proud of the fact that we have a local fan in charge of the club. The idea of having a oil rich billionaire doesn't sit that well with me either, especially if the wealth has come from a dodgy background. 

Unfortunately I feel like Gibson has lost the plot since Eindhoven in 2006, I understand the need to balance the books and run the club more sensibly but his decision making since the Southgate appointment has been awful. You can add Strachan, Agnew, Pulis and a few other names to that as well.

It feels to me like we're coming towards the end of an era, I never thought I'd think this but if he calls it a day I wouldn't be particularly bothered. 

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I wouldn't rule out big money signings in the future because of people like Merson and Gazza. They were both off the rails before they signed for us although Merson did still deliver on the pitch. 

You could look at players from the same era like Gianluca Festa to see that foreign players on big wages can settle in the area and deliver consistently on the pitch. 

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2 hours ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Merson struggled partly because he was living with Gazza, which was quite possibly the worst idea in the world. I mean honestly, who at the club thought that was a good idea?

Gibson and Robson? 

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Club is being ran terribly, and that’s down to Gibson. Is what he is doing here much different to how Ashley is running Newcastle, or how Short ran Sunderland? Media jumped all over their owners yet Gibson is regarded in the media and among the majority of our fan base as being one of the best owners in football. Just don’t understand it, clearly has an incredible PR team behind him 

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My take on SG is I don't necessarily think he's running the club badly in the sense that he's continually supported the club off his own back and kept us competitive where a lot of owners recently have just pulled out. I do however think that he's stuck in the past he's done very little to change how we've been ran other than sign a bigger cheque each season.

Changing the philosophy of the club to play attractive attacking football whilst signing young players we can develop and sell on is probably the holygrail in terms of  a philosophy that numerous clubs have already been attempting. Putting someone like Woodgate in charge (who personally I don't support) doesn't really inspire confidence for the fans, we debated that to death before he got the job. Granted it takes more than 3 games for change to happen and although I don't have faith in the manager, I have faith we will still have a decent season and finish mid table.

There's always one constant at MFC at that's Gibbo and we haven't moved with the times, I don't believe we aren't an attractive proposal for a buyer; decent facilities, decent squad, good stadium and the fan base is there if the team is. It's just as likely a new owner would be worse, they wouldn't have the same view of the club as Gibbo but there isn't much of an alternative, one day he will have to give up control of the club and what then? Another local business person? Unlikely (I can't actually think of any haha!) His daughter? Korean business man? Who knows. 

He's all I've known as a Middlesbrough fan and I don't think he's a god, not any more at least. If he continues for another 10 years then that's fine, that's his right, I don't have to like it but I won't stop supporting Middlesbrough. If he wants to sell (which I think he should sooner rather than later) then I'll be one of the first to thank him and vote to have a stand named after him or a statue built for him. UTB!

Ps. Sorry for the essay and feel free to call this a knee-jerk reaction to losing to another lower league side in the cup And only having 1 point after 2 games (it probably is!).

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My opinion is he becomes a little bit less bulletproof each season, with more and more bizarre decisions and appointments yet recruitment is continually left unaddressed. This season has seen a different approach but was it the right approach to leave the usual crowd in charge?

Not to take away from his great contributions in the past, he will always be a legend for that, but that old phrase about if you stick around long enough you become the bad guy is definitely true, and each season it seems more and more fans seem to turn against him. Still, it's his ball I suppose.

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The Club's nett value is -£57m. Nobody would pay Gibson O'Neill money to own a club with far less than zero value.

In the Championship without Parachute Payments the Club can't compete and cover the wage bill, so losses will continue. These losses need to be guaranteed. External finance is not an option, so Gibson O'Neill have no option but to further cover these losses (as Undertakings to Group in the Accounts)

Gibson has only ever actually put a total of £64m in to the Club. £1m up until 2012, then £50m in 2012. This was his biggest ever financial commitment and had to be done given the Banks would no longer finance the club debt with loans and overdraft. He put another £13m in up to 2016 the promotion season. He has put nothing in since, despite the FFP rules allowing him to inject £8m per year in the Championship, or £30m in the PL. 

Gibson O'Neill are owed c£80m by subsidiary MFC.

I'm sure Gibson would sell the club if he could get the £80m intra Group loan settled and could get his shareholding out.

£150m might be a fair price for a Premier League Club of MFC size, but nobody in their right mind would pay £150m for a Business that is currently worse than worthless, will lose money every season in this league and has a hell of a job to get out of it.

But the thing is Gibson literally only has himself to blame. He is the owner, the Executive Chairman and makes ALL the key decisions over budgets and people. With 100% control, goes 100% accountability. His decisions won us a cup, played in Europe, built us the stadium and Rockliffe, signed us the glamour stars etc. He got the adulation, deserved it and loved it.

But his decisions also see us languish where we do, pretty much where he started out with full control (Henderson, Fordy and Moscowicz saved the Club in 86).

His decisions since 2006 have been largely bad. His decisions since promotion in 2016 have been barmy. Karanka gave him the opportunity to make profit in the PL and to get the club established up there (there is the budget to do that in the PL) He blew it and has made things worse with Monk and Pulis.

So we now have an owner who can't financially compete, doesn't put money in even when it's allowed and makes incredibly bad people decisions on running the Club.

We should always be grateful for his vision, energy and ambition to 2006 and the honourable way he has put £64m in and stood guarantee for loans to cover losses when nobody else would. He'd be worth that statue or a stand name. But remember it is his decisions and his mistakes he has had to cover.

Would we really be so badly off if someone else was making better decisions?

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1 hour ago, Boranup said:

His decisions since promotion in 2016 have been barmy. Karanka gave him the opportunity to make profit in the PL and to get the club established up there (there is the budget to do that in the PL) He blew it and has made things worse with Monk and Pulis.

Would we really be so badly off if someone else was making better decisions?

Im not going to question your analysis of the Club's finances  - I am not familiar as you appear to be with the latest Balance Sheet. But your quote that he blew the opportunity with Karanka in the PL. How did he blow it exactly?

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Regardless of what mistakes Gibson has made and he's made quite a few, the fans would vote overwhelmingly to keep Gibbo at the helm. What Steve Gibson has done for this football club is nothing short of miraculous , since being in charge the positives far outweigh the negatives, as a fan/supporter grateful doesn't cut it in my eyes.   

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1 hour ago, Kiwi in London said:

Im not going to question your analysis of the Club's finances  - I am not familiar as you appear to be with the latest Balance Sheet. But your quote that he blew the opportunity with Karanka in the PL. How did he blow it exactly?

By not backing him in January. We only needed a few players and we would have been fine, instead we sign Gestede, Bamford and Guedioura. Look at similar size clubs such as Bournemouth, Southampton, Burnley, Watford, Palace, Brighton who are thriving in that league. That should have been us as well if the right decisions had been made that year

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