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Boro V Wigan 1-0 (Assombalonga)

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1 minute ago, TeaCider24 said:

I imagine that they would be much worse if it was the second half of last season, when people really started laying in to Pulis.

But Pulis has been a manager for 27 years and Woodgate has been one for a month.

What does the length of time Woodgate has been in charge matter?  All I'm talking about is the performance tonight, that's it.  In my opinion it was no better than much of last season and actually worse so I'm confused why people would find much, if any, positivity in it?  What you seem to be saying here is that actually there was no difference but we'll be more positive because Woodgate's less experienced and our new Head Coach?  I don't see why we should judge the actual performances any differently to how we would last season though?  Surely the performance is the performance, whoever is in charge?  And it's not like I'm sticking up for Pulis here because I couldn't stand the way we played!

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6 minutes ago, DanFromDownSouth said:

I made the list wooo!! 

Can I add I am certainly not talking up the performance! Saying there were positives yes. 

In my opinion, people are more aware of tonight's positives because we are trying to play a certain way. A more creative, entertaining positive brand of football. Comparing last season (and Pulis) to this season (and Woodgate) is like chalk and cheese.

You see, this is where I don't get it.  Because I haven't seen any evidence whatsoever of us playing a more creative, entertaining, positive brand of football and if you're telling me there was tonight then honestly mate I just don't see it at all.  That might be Woodgate's ultimate goal but not tonight it wasn't, not even close.

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7 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

No, I read it, I just thought it was mostly nonsense mate.  Actually, that might not be fair.  You were pretty happy with Pulis for the most part so you are probably able to feel more positive about less, certainly more than I am able to, so that probably explains the difference in opinion.  Fair play to you 👍

I always said under Pulis that so long as it was effective, I was happy. Tonight I think we were effective enough to deserve a win and yes, I feel positive about that. I'm not expecting big changes overnight, I'm expecting a transition and I personally see it in parts, more so after the goal, before it we were much worse I think.

Do I think we'll beat better teams than Wigan playing like that? Probably not. But we've beaten what was in front of us, so three cheers for us tonight.

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3 minutes ago, SmogDane said:

Because we at least TRY to win the ball high up the pitch.. 
Because we fielded more than one or 2 attackminded players.
Because we tried to go for a second and came close... 
Because JW is not TP

Sometimes we did and sometimes we didn't.  I'm not as impressed about this as other people seem to be though so that's on me anyway.

We fielded three attacking players instead of two and none of them played especially well although Fletcher was the best of the lot I'd say.

You don't think we ever did that under Pulis?  It's not like we were charging forward tonight at every opportunity.  Sorry but it's not.

I know he isn't and I'm delighted about that as you know.  That has nothing to do with how we played tonight though, which was poorly and with very little intent for anything.

Thanks for answering 👍

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, TeaCider24 said:

 

Woodgate is at least talking of bringing a more positive game and the fans who didn't hate him from the moment of his appointment or before will probably try to see the seeds of that intent amongst the dirt, even if there's a lot of dirt.

He's had 5 competitive games in his managerial career.

Sorry mate, you edited your post while I was replying to it, I think.

Yeah, I know Woodgate is talking about those things and I am very eager to see it.  However, I didn't see it tonight, nor did I see the seeds of it as you put it.  Like I've said a few times now, I saw a performance that had it been last season would have been universally criticised on here (except for Wilson who is a very decent and friendly oddball).  So new manager or not, my feelings are that there isn't anything to be positive about.  If we start playing some good stuff, let's say we do on Saturday, then I will be able to understand that, even if we ended up losing.  But tonight felt like some games last season to me where we were able to win but didn't impress at all.  In fact, I honestly think we were better in some games last season and I thought last season was pretty dire stuff for the most part.

Edited by Changing Times

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14 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said:

I always said under Pulis that so long as it was effective, I was happy. Tonight I think we were effective enough to deserve a win and yes, I feel positive about that. I'm not expecting big changes overnight, I'm expecting a transition and I personally see it in parts, more so after the goal, before it we were much worse I think.

Do I think we'll beat better teams than Wigan playing like that? Probably not. But we've beaten what was in front of us, so three cheers for us tonight.

We were able to beat what was in front of us last season as well.  I suppose I am waiting to see more and I didn't see anything tonight even though we won.  Like I say, the performance is the performance whoever is in charge but maybe that's a flawed way of looking at it, I don't know.

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1 minute ago, Denzel Zanzibar said:

Jesus *** christ CT, calm down.

calm down chill out GIF

People kicked off about my post not the other way around.  I was just confused about certain things as I often am on here 🙂

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8 minutes ago, Changing Times said:

We were able to beat what was in front of us last season as well.  I suppose I am waiting to see more and I didn't see anything tonight even though we won.  Like I say, the performance is the performance whoever is in charge but maybe that's a flawed way of looking at it, I don't know.

Like I said in my other post, people hated Pulis for far more than that. I don't think all of it was actually justified, certainly not to begin with and certainly not all the time. Surely this situation proves that more than anything, where people can see a similar thing from a different manager and feel quite significantly different about it. There was that undertone to his tenure that existed far beyond what people saw at the Riverside and it bled into the atmosphere within the Stadium too, I imagine. I think at times some hated him more for the reputation of his football than they actually hated his football to begin with, despite claiming that it was entirely the latter and I find that quite bizarre.

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I fully agree with CT on this, that performance tonight was absolutely turgid and nothing like what Woodgate has said he wants his teams to play like. I'm personally of the opinion that I don't really care about performance aslong as we win, but we were getting results under Pulis mostly and played much better than what I seen tonight for the most part. Confirmation Bias is definitely effecting peoples positivity on Pulis football vs Woodgate football.

I have absolutely no doubt we would have had more points on the board so far and been through in the cup if TP was still in charge, but as has been said, Woodgate might just need time, but if anybody can sit and say what we produced tonight was better than 'Pulisball' they aren't being subjective at all and are purely basing it on a dislike for Pulis.

FWIW I thought it was time for Pulis to go so this isn't me defending TP, but what we're seeing isnt much different to last year. 

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I thought there were ‘flashes’ in the first half where we did pull off the odd quick passing move, mostly through McNair.

However I’d agree about the confirmation bias, I spent most of that game as bored as I was last season, we didn’t really trouble their keeper and we went long just as often as we did under pulis. 

Was there enough there showing evidence of ‘the new era’? Other than a more attack minded line up no I don’t think there was.

The three points were vital and hopefully it will help them all mentally but let’s be honest, we were poor and Wigan were even worse.

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It feels a bit to me like we were under Monk, no real style of play or organisation.  Monk was sacked because it was still the same after a few months with no signs he knew what he was doing but hopefully under Woodgate we start progressing into an organised outfit.  Hopefully.

Hopefully.

 

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Unbelievably the team we put out is the same as monks minus 3 players! Braithwaite, Christie and friend.

Its weird how this time 2 years ago we were optimistic for promotion with play offs being seen as almost a failure. 

I guess it makes a difference not having adama and bamford sat on the bench 😪

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2 hours ago, Adam P said:

I fully agree with CT on this, that performance tonight was absolutely turgid and nothing like what Woodgate has said he wants his teams to play like. I'm personally of the opinion that I don't really care about performance aslong as we win, but we were getting results under Pulis mostly and played much better than what I seen tonight for the most part. Confirmation Bias is definitely effecting peoples positivity on Pulis football vs Woodgate football.

I have absolutely no doubt we would have had more points on the board so far and been through in the cup if TP was still in charge, but as has been said, Woodgate might just need time, but if anybody can sit and say what we produced tonight was better than 'Pulisball' they aren't being subjective at all and are purely basing it on a dislike for Pulis.

FWIW I thought it was time for Pulis to go so this isn't me defending TP, but what we're seeing isnt much different to last year. 

I said during the game it looks exactly like the home games from last season, lethargic with the ball and no cutting edge. We get the ball in positions for either a cross or a 1 on 1 with the defender but we don't have the players for it, just ends up cycling back through the centre midfielders and then back to the defence or we lose it. No quality creative nous whatsoever in this squad. 

Definitely picked up after the goal but we're definitely 3-4 players short of finishing top half and short of confidence. Fletcher looks up for it dropping deep and ran with it a few times but put his shots wide, McNair is our best player so far this season and Britt looked a lot more involved in the game after his goal.

Just not feeling 4-3-3 with our wide options, I want to see 4-1-2-1-2 diamond for a game with Browne just behind Fletcher and Britt. I'm of the belief that wide players are the most important in the championship as width kills teams in this league but no point shoehorning Fletcher on the left and trying to convince ourselves Johnson is a good starting championship winger. 

------------------Randolph

Dijksteel---Ayala---Not Shotton---Bola

-------McNair---Clayts---Howson

-------------------Browne

---------------Britt-------Fletcher

Wing needs a game off, asking a lot of the full backs that formation but I thought Bola played decent tonight was surprised he got taken off and Dijksteel deserves a second crack at it 

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I haven't read back through the full thread but I agree with the more recent comments on this page. 

It was a good result last night and a much needed 3 points, but in terms of a spectacle it wasn't much different to the Pulis football. 

I thought we played a bit of decent football in spells but I was surprised that we actually sat quite deep at times and I didn't really see much evidence of a high press. Overall I thought both teams looked like midtable/ bottom half teams. 

If Woodgate is tempering his style for short term results then I won't criticise him for that but I don't think last night needs to be dressed up for something that it's not either. 

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