RealSlimSladeyy 766 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 28 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said: I don't disagree with that, I'm not really pining for him to come back either. It really just seems to be people pining for the success that we not that long ago had. People have even considered how much better this season would be with Pulis in charge so we can all see how quickly people can forget how they once felt. It's about more than just success, it's about feeling united and connected to the club. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 7 minutes ago, RealSlimSladeyy said: It's about more than just success, it's about feeling united and connected to the club. That's very true. But I think when he left, that united, connected status had long since gone with a lot of people and you could tell it in his character. I think we can all pretty much guarantee he won't be given the time he had before by fans because as soon as things go wrong, it won't be the positivity and success that people remember. It will be the dark days of Charlton and the Premier League. This place is a bit of a hunting ground for managers right now, despite the problem not really being the managers. I said it a fair bit earlier this season but if things go wrong this year, people need to point the finger in the direction of Gibson and yet apart from maybe on here, it's all too often that the manager is the main cause of everything. Every time I go on Twitter and see that Woodgate is getting the brunt of everything that's going wrong, it makes me cringe. Managers like Pulis and Karanka won't even get any of the benefit of the doubt in that regard, we know they have the capabilities to get results out of teams and when it goes wrong, everyone will pile on them. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
RealSlimSladeyy 766 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 21 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said: That's very true. But I think when he left, that united, connected status had long since gone with a lot of people and you could tell it in his character. I think we can all pretty much guarantee he won't be given the time he had before by fans because as soon as things go wrong, it won't be the positivity and success that people remember. It will be the dark days of Charlton and the Premier League. This place is a bit of a hunting ground for managers right now, despite the problem not really being the managers. I said it a fair bit earlier this season but if things go wrong this year, people need to point the finger in the direction of Gibson and yet apart from maybe on here, it's all too often that the manager is the main cause of everything. Every time I go on Twitter and see that Woodgate is getting the brunt of everything that's going wrong, it makes me cringe. Managers like Pulis and Karanka won't even get any of the benefit of the doubt in that regard, we know they have the capabilities to get results out of teams and when it goes wrong, everyone will pile on them. Absolutely. I know deep down Karanka is not the answer. I know the problems are far more deep-rooted than the manager. But I can't lie, if Karanka was brought back I'd feel glorious, right up until the point where the board do something stupid and remind me that this mess is theirs. Link to post Share on other sites
Rioch's Braves 711 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 13 hours ago, Neverbefore said: So how much of that well backing got us promoted? Dimi (free) Nsue (free) gibson (academy) ayala (300k) friend (150k) Leadbitter (free) clayton (1mil) Stuani (2mil) ramirez (loan) adomah (1mil) Kike (2.5mil) Yes we spent big money on downing and Rhodes. Neither of which karanka cared about and neither of which were the difference between getting promoted or not. This retrospective bias against ak is purely media and gibson driven. He did a remarkable job. That's your opinion, got tactically outwitted by Howe, Jokanovic and Alex Neill in the play off final, we got promoted after holding on defending for a draw against 10 man Brighton. we should have been promoted easily with the squad we had. The season under Karanka in the PL was a disaster, a manager who refused to change tactics even when defeat was staring him full in the face, so he did a decent job in my opinion no more then that. Not the 2nd coming that some on here might have us believe. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Motor Mouth 255 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 33 minutes ago, RealSlimSladeyy said: Absolutely. I know deep down Karanka is not the answer. I know the problems are far more deep-rooted than the manager. But I can't lie, if Karanka was brought back I'd feel glorious, right up until the point where the board do something stupid and remind me that this mess is theirs. I make you spot on mate Gibson needs to be ousted and his lackey's before any changes that are made will be of any difference. Whilst Gibson is at the wheel we are only going one way and that is down no matter who comes through those gates it will make little difference. And the quicker the crowd that is left realises this and gets on his back the faster we will get an owner who will hopefully invest in the club. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Rioch's Braves 711 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 16 hours ago, p_mards said: Bola and Dijksteel are very raw but certainly have potential. Sorry for repeating this point for about the third time on here, but them two would massively benefit from a top quality coach who will drill them defensively - someone akin to Karanka. If the plan is to buying young talent and improve them, like we are led to believe, with good coaching and game time then having Woodgate as our manager completely undermines it. Bola is 22 years old with 80 league games behind him, Dijksteel is 23 with over 40 odd games for Charlton ( they're hardly youngsters) if you haven't learnt the basics of defending by now the chances are your not going to. If the skillset and ability aren't there in the 1st place then I don't care who the coach is, hence the silk purse into sows ear comment earlier. Link to post Share on other sites
Erimus 63 478 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 11 minutes ago, Motor Mouth said: I make you spot on mate Gibson needs to be ousted and his lackey's before any changes that are made will be of any difference. Whilst Gibson is at the wheel we are only going one way and that is down no matter who comes through those gates it will make little difference. And the quicker the crowd that is left realises this and gets on his back the faster we will get an owner who will hopefully invest in the club. How would you oust Gibson? he's the owner. It's easier said than done. Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 23 minutes ago, Motor Mouth said: I make you spot on mate Gibson needs to be ousted and his lackey's before any changes that are made will be of any difference. Whilst Gibson is at the wheel we are only going one way and that is down no matter who comes through those gates it will make little difference. And the quicker the crowd that is left realises this and gets on his back the faster we will get an owner who will hopefully invest in the club. It's not his inability to invest that bothers me. I'd still rather have him in charge than anyone else but for it to ever get better, he has to stand up and admit he can't continue making football decisions the way he has recently and he has to invest what money we have in someone who can direct the footballing operations of the club from top to bottom. He needs someone who can do a much better job of delivering a long-term future rather than being someone who doesn't know where or how to invest in delivering that, committing to promises he will fundamentally be incapable of fulfilling as he reverts to type and gets a man who he likes and trusts personally regardless of what they actually deliver regarding the promises he's made, scraping the bottom of the managerial barrel to push forward another scapegoat of his own failures. He needs someone who can not turn a blind eye to shoddy recruitment and overvalued buys and rectify those practices. He needs a good director of football and he needs them soon, otherwise he will be the sole culprit in my eyes of catastrophic failure since relegation. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
boro-unger 3,817 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 I'd have AK back in a heartbeat. He turned round a club that was heading for league 1 under Mogga and showed progression in each full season he had. People forget how good we were in the first half of the prem season - we weren't in the bottom three at all until the second half of the season. Then unfortunately he bottled it and went all out defence. Still, it's not like we did any better once he was gone. I'd take Houghton or Jokanovic as well. Both decent managers. Just not the little gremlin Warnock please 1 Link to post Share on other sites
macapes 1,886 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 35 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said: It's not his inability to invest that bothers me. I'd still rather have him in charge than anyone else but for it to ever get better, he has to stand up and admit he can't continue making football decisions the way he has recently and he has to invest what money we have in someone who can direct the footballing operations of the club from top to bottom. He needs someone who can do a much better job of delivering a long-term future rather than being someone who doesn't know where or how to invest in delivering that, committing to promises he will fundamentally be incapable of fulfilling as he reverts to type and gets a man who he likes and trusts personally regardless of what they actually deliver regarding the promises he's made, scraping the bottom of the managerial barrel to push forward another scapegoat of his own failures. He needs someone who can not turn a blind eye to shoddy recruitment and overvalued buys and rectify those practices. He needs a good director of football and he needs them soon, otherwise he will be the sole culprit in my eyes of catastrophic failure since relegation. Spot on. It also needs, desperately, to be someone from outside the club structure, someone who says "no" to him and who has authority to make actual changes without his approval. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Naisby 736 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 Im probably in a small minority but wouldn’t have AK back anywhere near the club, too divisive, wasn’t a fan of his and although was responsible for promotion he was also responsible for relegation. Warnock as Manager will only happen if Woodgate either walks of his own free will as we don’t have the money for compensation and golden handshakes, Or both he and Warnock agree a partnership arrangement. Imo a more likely arrangement would be a Director of Football roll for Warnock, but I’m not sure whether either Woodgate or Gibson would want another opinion bringing to the table, especially one who could argue his views and back them up with previous results. Gibson has always appointed managers based on whichever philosophy he is running the club with at that time and our financial outlook. Personally I think he prefers inexperienced managers he can shape and influence as he likes to be the boss and run things directly but while publicly keeping his distance, when these appointments fail he does a 180’ flip and appoints an old experienced manager who remember the old days of the chairman/manager relationship and can be counted on to keep him out of things publicly. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
wilsoncgp 9,230 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 26 minutes ago, macapes said: Spot on. It also needs, desperately, to be someone from outside the club structure, someone who says "no" to him and who has authority to make actual changes without his approval. Aye, it'd be pointless if it was, ooooh say, Adrian Bevington...? Cannot be jobs for the boys otherwise nothing will change. Link to post Share on other sites
Naisby 736 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 25 minutes ago, macapes said: Spot on. It also needs, desperately, to be someone from outside the club structure, someone who says "no" to him and who has authority to make actual changes without his approval. Unfortunately Gibson is a business man who trusts his own opinions and expects those underhim to remember the philosophy “he who pays the piper calls the tune” The Two Bees ( Bevington & Bauser) are little more than yes men imo, but hey good money if you can get it, and if their boss wants them to be Yes men then why rock the boat. Link to post Share on other sites
macapes 1,886 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 7 minutes ago, wilsoncgp said: Aye, it'd be pointless if it was, ooooh say, Adrian Bevington...? Cannot be jobs for the boys otherwise nothing will change. Exactly the name I was thinking of. As Naisby says though, would Gibbo sanction anyone even vaguely independent? You'd think he'd recall the last decent success was with outside influence. Link to post Share on other sites
Downsouth 6,176 Posted December 7, 2019 Share Posted December 7, 2019 6 minutes ago, macapes said: Exactly the name I was thinking of. As Naisby says though, would Gibbo sanction anyone even vaguely independent? You'd think he'd recall the last decent success was with outside influence. Welcome to the forum macapes enjoy your oneBoro expereince 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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